SS is the wick AND resistance wire

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KYFlyer67

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This is proof-of-concept, and I'm not very far along, so take this for what it's worth... I have read Raidy's infamous post that, amoung other things, introduces us to the "Genesis" atomizer. Of course the Genesis atomizers claim to fame is that is uses an "oxidized" stainless steel mesh wick. Raidy is brilliant by the way. I have to say that anytime I mention him in a post because, wow, it's true. Anyway, after I read about Raidy's Genesis invention, I had to get my hands on some stainless steel mesh. So I ordered the mesh a while ago, and received it a couple weeks ago. It works like a charm. Nice. So I started experimenting with things... Once thing I wanted to try is using the SS mesh as the wick AND resistance wire. In other words, I wanted to see if I could use SS mesh and avoid the use of Nichrome/Kanthal. This is not my idea - Pailpoe has been working on this for some time now - thanks Pailpoe. Pailpose is using a pretty large SS mesh wick/resistance wire and powering it with something like 10 or 12 volts. I wanted to see if I could shrink this down to 510 atomizer size and 3.7 volts. The secret to doing this is to use a very small amount of SS mesh.

Cut a narrow strip of SS mesh, about an eighth of an inch wide. Now roll it at an angle so as to make a long wick. Roll it the same way you would roll electrical tape if you were covering a long wire. The pictures tell the story. DSCF0081.jpg DSCF0082.jpg DSCF0083.jpg DSCF0084.jpg DSCF0089.jpg
 

WillyB

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Can't quite tell what I'm looking at. And were is the liquid wicking from?






FWIW infamous is an odd choice of adjectives.

–adjective

1. having an extremely bad reputation: an infamous city.
2. deserving of or causing an evil reputation; shamefully malign; detestable: an infamous deed.

—Synonyms

1. disreputable, ill-famed, notorious. 2. disgraceful, scandalous; nefarious, odious, wicked, shocking, vile, base, heinous, villainous.

Is that what you meant? :)
 

KYFlyer67

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WillyB,

Infamous is definitely the wrong word - how 'bout "legendary"?

There is no wicking going on in the pictures. I just dripped juice on the wick for testing purposes. I do have one in a modded 510 atomizer now. I wrapped the SS mesh around silica strands. The strands are wrapped only in the middle part of the SS wick and they hang down into the juice. I works pretty well, but I have lots of tweaking to do. I'll get some pictures up of a working atomizer once I get a little further along.
 

roadrash

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This is proof-of-concept, and I'm not very far along, so take this for what it's worth... I have read Raidy's infamous post that, amoung other things, introduces us to the "Genesis" atomizer. Of course the Genesis atomizers claim to fame is that is uses an "oxidized" stainless steel mesh wick. Raidy is brilliant by the way. I have to say that anytime I mention him in a post because, wow, it's true. Anyway, after I read about Raidy's Genesis invention, I had to get my hands on some stainless steel mesh. So I ordered the mesh a while ago, and received it a couple weeks ago. It works like a charm. Nice. So I started experimenting with things... Once thing I wanted to try is using the SS mesh as the wick AND resistance wire. In other words, I wanted to see if I could use SS mesh and avoid the use of Nichrome/Kanthal. This is not my idea - Pailpoe has been working on this for some time now - thanks Pailpoe. Pailpose is using a pretty large SS mesh wick/resistance wire and powering it with something like 10 or 12 volts. I wanted to see if I could shrink this down to 510 atomizer size and 3.7 volts. The secret to doing this is to use a very small amount of SS mesh.

Cut a narrow strip of SS mesh, about an eighth of an inch wide. Now roll it at an angle so as to make a long wick. Roll it the same way you would roll electrical tape if you were covering a long wire. The pictures tell the story. View attachment 30706 View attachment 30707 View attachment 30708 View attachment 30709 View attachment 30710

I tried this also, but I had a bear of a time trying to solder lead wires on the ends. Never thought of using my # 13 atty mod.

what ohms are you getting from pin to pin?
 

roadrash

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WillyB,

Infamous is definitely the wrong word - how 'bout "legendary"?

There is no wicking going on in the pictures. I just dripped juice on the wick for testing purposes. I do have one in a modded 510 atomizer now. I wrapped the SS mesh around silica strands. The strands are wrapped only in the middle part of the SS wick and they hang down into the juice. I works pretty well, but I have lots of tweaking to do. I'll get some pictures up of a working atomizer once I get a little further along.

Got a few more questions and observations, but :) I'll just wait for the pictures.:pop:
 

WillyB

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WillyB,

Infamous is definitely the wrong word - how 'bout "legendary"?

There is no wicking going on in the pictures. I just dripped juice on the wick for testing purposes. I wrapped the SS mesh around silica strands. The strands are wrapped only in the middle part of the SS wick and they hang down into the juice.
Maybe a bit too early for 'legendary' status. :)

You really should work on a no fiber approach with your experiments, using only the SS.
 

Scubabatdan

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Ok, I tried it, my resistance is .6 ohms. I used 1/4" 400SS and rolled it and connected between the srew posts of my quick change atty. By leaving 3/8" tail it springs up to touch the batting and wicks the juice down. STRONG throat hit! and tons of vapor. Here is a pic of the setup:
iPhone 001.jpg

Wow, this works good!!!
If I curve it so there is more heating coil area that would increase my resistance...
I will play with it!
Dan
 

KYFlyer67

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Ok, I tried it, my resistance is .6 ohms. I used 1/4" 400SS and rolled it and connected between the srew posts of my quick change atty. By leaving 3/8" tail it springs up to touch the batting and wicks the juice down. STRONG throat hit! and tons of vapor. Here is a pic of the setup:
View attachment 30847

Wow, this works good!!!
If I curve it so there is more heating coil area that would increase my resistance...
I will play with it!
Dan

Nice, Dan! Maybe we're onto something here. I'm finding that's there's a real balancing act to this. Too much mesh and you don't get enough vapor. Too little mesh and it burns hot - and I mean HOT. Also, depending on how you're wrapping the mesh and a million other variables, you may be wicking too much or too little liquid - not good in either case. I've also noticed that the mesh glows bright orange and heats up the entire atomizer the SECOND it dries out. Still, I think this is doable. So I have a photobucket account now... Let's see if it works (next post)

WillyB - I completely agree with you on the "no fiber". I'll get there.
 

KYFlyer67

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Pictures Below:

Ohm reading on one of my first resistance wicks (that's what I'm gonna call it until someone comes up with something better).
Vapor from an R-wick (decided to shorten the name) mounted to helping hands.
Vapor from an R-wick on an atty (please ignore the workmanship). This one tested at 1.3 Ohms
Same atty and R-wick burning dry - not good.

Much more tweaking to go...

MeshOhms.jpg

HHMeshVapor.jpg

AMeshVapor.jpg

AMeshGlowing.jpg
 

asdaq

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1.5Ω sounds quite reasonable, is there any noticeable difference in resistance when it is wet? I can certainly imagine the heat it puts out when glowing like that, keeping the resistance stable sounds hard too. Also with this rolling method it seems the grid like shape of the mesh gets compressed in various areas. I wonder if there were a larger cylinder of mesh mounted on the outside of the leads instead, if this would give any sizable resistance?
 

KYFlyer67

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1.5Ω sounds quite reasonable, is there any noticeable difference in resistance when it is wet? I can certainly imagine the heat it puts out when glowing like that, keeping the resistance stable sounds hard too. Also with this rolling method it seems the grid like shape of the mesh gets compressed in various areas. I wonder if there were a larger cylinder of mesh mounted on the outside of the leads instead, if this would give any sizable resistance?

I haven't noticed different resistance when wet. I think a cylinder of mesh on the outside could be problematic. This stuff quickly builds an oxidation layer. The cylinder on the outside would probably lose contact with the wick on the inside. However, I'm trying to take advantage of the oxidation property. I'm attaching oxidized mesh to the unoxidized part to provide wicking "legs" to hang down into the juice. I don't think I'm explaining this well - I'll post pics. Dan's setup looks pretty good to me because it allows one continuous piece of SS mesh to serve as wick and heating element. However, I like to build really small attys (510 size) and it's very difficult to use screws at this size. I'm trying to make this work with Boertjie's "needles and pins" design.
 

roadrash

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Nice, Dan! Maybe we're onto something here. I'm finding that's there's a real balancing act to this. Too much mesh and you don't get enough vapor. QUOTE]

Is this at 3.7 volts?

would it be best to try to get this to work just dripping first. Then work on on the feeding part after?
 
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asdaq

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Sure, I get what you mean with the legs, I don't think mine explained too well-- a bigger diameter tube of mesh on the outside of your posts, probably not going to work.

My first try with some mesh was in a similar 510 setup but the bottom of the wick shorted too easily to the metal case and I quickly abandoned that. However, you could put this to your advantage and have the center pole like it is, and have the other be at the base of the connector somehow isolated from the center. The wick would be an inverted 'J' and allow for a longer length for some more resistance. If the liquid were allowed to pool in the bottom, it would keep that part cooled so the action would happen where it isn't submerged. This is just an idea, undoubtedly still quite problematic.
 

KYFlyer67

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asdaq - The inverted J might work - just be careful about getting the heat too close to the battery. This things gets very hot when dry. Did I say that already :) Also, I think Dan made an excellent point about keeping airflow close to the fire - that should help.

This is getting good. Really good. Pics below show my wick with oxidized legs, wick with oxidized legs mounted on an atty, and finally the atty in action - basically a smoke bomb! It vapes very good. It tested at 1.0 Ohms. I'd like to get the Ohms up a little because this thing burns hot and will probably drain a battery pretty quickly.

WickWLegs.jpg


WickWLegsOnAtty.jpg


SmokeBomb.jpg
 

KYFlyer67

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Nice, Dan! Maybe we're onto something here. I'm finding that's there's a real balancing act to this. Too much mesh and you don't get enough vapor. QUOTE]

Is this at 3.7 volts?

would it be best to try to get this to work just dripping first. Then work on on the feeding part after?

Yes - a single eGo battery. My first tests were with just dripping. It dries out quick though, so I don't think dripping will be useful beyond testing. My wicks are rolled narrow strips - see 1st pictures. I think I can adjust the resistance while keeping the length the same by overlapping the wraps more or less. Mostly I just need to keep experimenting to find the sweet spot.
 

WillyB

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Ok, I tried it, my resistance is .6 ohms. I used 1/4" 400SS and rolled it and connected between the srew posts of my quick change atty. By leaving 3/8" tail it springs up to touch the batting and wicks the juice down. STRONG throat hit! and tons of vapor. Here is a pic of the setup:
Wow, this works good!!!
WTH Dan what you were running it on? That thing would want to pull over 6A @ 3.8V.
 
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