I'm big into labeling, so everything I touch will have tape wrapped around it with the contents, date it was either opened (or mixed), and possible what I plan to use it for later
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I use a Sharpie pen on white electrical tape. Unlike most labels, electrical tape comes off glass bottles easily and cleanly when it's time to re-use them. It doesn't look fancy, but I'm doing it strictly for myself, so I don't care.
I'm a label freak!
I spent a lot of time in the lab for my degree and my mother spent more than 40 years in a medical lab. I know my mother will stick her nose in to my mixing area when she is up here and you can bet I have that sucker inspection ready at all times
I spent a lot of time in the lab for my degree and my mother spent more than 40 years in a medical lab. I know my mother will stick her nose in to my mixing area when she is up here and you can bet I have that sucker inspection ready at all times
I don't think either is better as far as dissolved per se. Pg would be easier to use especially when shaking it up to use. That is what I use but I mix mine @ 30pg/70 vg max as well as 70 pg/30vg. Works good for either way. You would need to find out the happy medium as to how far you want to go as a maximum vg juice. If you want 100vg then yes, go with the vg mix. If you can withstand not going any higher than about 80 vg, 100 pg could work for you. Hope this helps.
I'm pretty sure wizard labs has some Vg-based flavors, and possibly bullcityvapor.com also. Though vaping "organic" isn't necessarily always best; organic compounds may have many things in them that don't vape well at all, or could even be dangerous; lab-created flavors will vaporize more cleanly, and won't have the "bad" stuff, since it would have to be specifically added to be there at all.
Andria
AndriaD, I agree. Some organics can have sugars that gunk up coils, and may produce esters that can be harmful. That is why I don't mind using other flavors, too. I don't assume organic vapor is always best, the way organic food is better for you.
I'd look into any flavors, organic or not, before choosing that company/flavor. That is partially why I am not against FDA regulations of e-juice. I know I'm one of the few in the community who would like to see some regulations, but it would make it more clear what is safer to use. I'd even be willing to lose some flavors for it. Historically, private industry has been notoriously bad at regulating itself
I'd look into any flavors, organic or not, before choosing that company/flavor. That is partially why I am not against FDA regulations of e-juice. I know I'm one of the few in the community who would like to see some regulations, but it would make it more clear what is safer to use. I'd even be willing to lose some flavors for it. Historically, private industry has been notoriously bad at regulating itself
And the goverment is GOOD at regulation? You mean like they did for Big Tobacco and the literally hundreds of additives (some addictive) that they allowed. With NO mention on the package what so ever.
You'll lose a lot more than a few flavors. You will lose 90 percent of the brands out there and be left with only a few that can either meet or control the FDA regulations. Guess who are the ones in a position to do that. You got it, our old friend Big Tobacco. But hey, you'll feel better about it because it says "Approved" on the side of the package.
You'll lose a lot more than a few flavors. You will lose 90 percent of the brands out there and be left with only a few that can either meet or control the FDA regulations. Guess who are the ones in a position to do that. You got it, our old friend Big Tobacco. But hey, you'll feel better about it because it says "Approved" on the side of the package.
I'm not saying all regulations are perfect, but they are better than none. As of today, China can sell whatever they want to, with whatever additives they want. Only those of us that know what to look for will stop buying it. But not every vaper is as vigilant. And for those that aren't, they are getting hurt. If the gov't regulates it, they make it safer for everyone. And the FDA is able to require stricter standards with controlled quality measures.
If you know anything about QA/QC, you know about standard operating procedures. When current companies get their juices tested at 3rd party labs, not all studies are done equally. When the FDA can establish SOP's for testing e juice, it will be easier to find flavors that are actually safe
If you know anything about QA/QC, you know about standard operating procedures. When current companies get their juices tested at 3rd party labs, not all studies are done equally. When the FDA can establish SOP's for testing e juice, it will be easier to find flavors that are actually safe
I have to disagree, that having it gov't regulated makes it in any way safer. It just makes it more expensive, OR, might make it disappear entirely. Cigarettes are "gov't regulated"... they're real safe.
Food is gov't regulated too, and it's still perfectly legal to put sulfites in anything they damn well please -- which could kill an asthmatic. I was asthmatic for 10 yrs before I even KNEW about sulfites.If the FDA would stop being such lazy, greedy slugs and come up with a new category that is neither tobacco nor drugs for the regulation of e-cig stuff... THEN it might be a little safer. But all they're currently doing is trying to figure out how to rake more tobacco money back into their pot, and help out their ....-buddies BP while they're at it -- can't have so many people not getting cancer or COPD, nooooooooo!
Andria
Horse Hockey.
Read above.
Why did you say China when the rules apply to all? Because it sounds Scary?
Do you think they are going to let us make our own juice on our kitchen tables if they start regulation? No way! To dangerous, we could hurt our selfs.
Who are these nonvigilant vapers that are getting hurt? I haven't heard of them. This is just hand ringing.
Government regulated the hell out of tobacco and they made it much less safe than raw tobacco.
And just what are we suppose to be testing for? What flavors have been proven not to be safe? And who is going to absorb the cost of these expensive test.
Vaping is not healthy. Period. Putting anything in to your lungs other than clean air probably isn't healthy. Government control isn't going to make it any safer and if it follows the same path as tobacco (and we are seeing the same players lining up) it may well turn out that regulation allows it to be even more unhealthy. Aside from shooting the cost of vaping way up over the cost of smoking and ending DIY where the user can control the ingredients, all FDA regulation is going to give you is a false sense of security.
Read above.
Why did you say China when the rules apply to all? Because it sounds Scary?
Do you think they are going to let us make our own juice on our kitchen tables if they start regulation? No way! To dangerous, we could hurt our selfs.
Who are these nonvigilant vapers that are getting hurt? I haven't heard of them. This is just hand ringing.
Government regulated the hell out of tobacco and they made it much less safe than raw tobacco.
And just what are we suppose to be testing for? What flavors have been proven not to be safe? And who is going to absorb the cost of these expensive test.
Vaping is not healthy. Period. Putting anything in to your lungs other than clean air probably isn't healthy. Government control isn't going to make it any safer and if it follows the same path as tobacco (and we are seeing the same players lining up) it may well turn out that regulation allows it to be even more unhealthy. Aside from shooting the cost of vaping way up over the cost of smoking and ending DIY where the user can control the ingredients, all FDA regulation is going to give you is a false sense of security.
Maybe this might help. Not sure, but I don't think it will hurt. I signed it for all its worth.
Urge the FDA to re-work the deeming regs so that life-saving vapor products can remain on the market!
Oh believe me, I stay involved with all of CASSA's work, make phone calls, etc. But frankly, I think it is hopeless. I plan on breaking the laws once they make it. And they will get made.
As you read above, there are people, even within our own ranks, who are willing to give up their freedom for what they perceive as safety.
Frankly, individuals with that attitude deserves neither.
I"m perfectly happy with allowing the deeming regs to be reworked. That's what I want, and what I let my reps know. But people seem to think that it will mean there won't be any regs for e-cigs. If we get the GF date pushed to 2015, what do you think will happen in 2020? Will you be satisfied that there wasn't been much progress in the last 5 years? Or will you throw up your hands in a tantrum again about how unfair the government is being to you. How would regulations allow it to be more unhealthy? With all of the pushing for better labeling of cigs, why would they not also push for better labeling of e-cigs?
AnddriaD, I agree. I want to see e-cigs put in a different category. That will force the FDA and other regulators to come up with completely new regulations for them, and new studies to back up those decisions. Unfortunately, the gov't is notorious for botching test results. That is partially why weed is still illegal.
I always hate the argument that "nothing is as healthy as breathing clean air". It's worthless argument, used as an excuse to do unhealthy things and not feel bad about it. It's the argument of libertarians and anarchists.
China is a big industry, and they sell junk juice. Keytones and aldehydes, diacetyl, benzyl alcohols are all ingredients that can be found in some brands of e-juice flavorings. You can argue that they aren't in high enough concentrations to hurt you, but they are there. Why are making the point that because cigs are bad, that e-cigs have the right to be just as bad. Shouldn't we be trying to do the studies and find out how we can prove they are better? Rutgers U just did a study showing that they help keep teens from smoking, but not that they are safer. Shouldn't we be pushing for better testing by Johnson & Johnson, GlaxoSmithKline, etc?
Small e-cig companies don't have the revenue to do those in-depth tests. And if we only fight for a new GF date, we are doing our own industry a disservice.
AnddriaD, I agree. I want to see e-cigs put in a different category. That will force the FDA and other regulators to come up with completely new regulations for them, and new studies to back up those decisions. Unfortunately, the gov't is notorious for botching test results. That is partially why weed is still illegal.
I always hate the argument that "nothing is as healthy as breathing clean air". It's worthless argument, used as an excuse to do unhealthy things and not feel bad about it. It's the argument of libertarians and anarchists.
China is a big industry, and they sell junk juice. Keytones and aldehydes, diacetyl, benzyl alcohols are all ingredients that can be found in some brands of e-juice flavorings. You can argue that they aren't in high enough concentrations to hurt you, but they are there. Why are making the point that because cigs are bad, that e-cigs have the right to be just as bad. Shouldn't we be trying to do the studies and find out how we can prove they are better? Rutgers U just did a study showing that they help keep teens from smoking, but not that they are safer. Shouldn't we be pushing for better testing by Johnson & Johnson, GlaxoSmithKline, etc?
Small e-cig companies don't have the revenue to do those in-depth tests. And if we only fight for a new GF date, we are doing our own industry a disservice.
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I apologize , your right and I'm all wrong.
Fighting for yours and my vaping rights is throwing my hands up in a tantrum.
Now that FDA has control over E-cigs, they will willingly give it up so they can be re-classified.
Vaping is healthy, much better than pure air.
China is evil and only makes crap. American is small industry and would never put diacetyl in their juice.
Small companies will thrive under tighter regulations because Big Tobacco will willing share in-depth test results freely with all and the government will tell the little guy they don't have to do this ultra-expensive test that would crush their business if they had to try to do the testing themselves.
You have opened my eyes. Government will keep us safe. Complete trust in the government is the only safe way.
IM OUT
Fighting for yours and my vaping rights is throwing my hands up in a tantrum.
Now that FDA has control over E-cigs, they will willingly give it up so they can be re-classified.
Vaping is healthy, much better than pure air.
China is evil and only makes crap. American is small industry and would never put diacetyl in their juice.
Small companies will thrive under tighter regulations because Big Tobacco will willing share in-depth test results freely with all and the government will tell the little guy they don't have to do this ultra-expensive test that would crush their business if they had to try to do the testing themselves.
You have opened my eyes. Government will keep us safe. Complete trust in the government is the only safe way.
IM OUT
Now that that's over, back to our talk about making juice.
I am a stickler for safety. But I live in a small row-home. I don't really have the space to set up a lab the way I'd like. Maybe if I could clean out my garage, but that would be an unbelievably long process. Any ideas on how to get a work station set up with limited space? There's a lab I used to work at in Jersey that I'd be able to get work done, but it's an hour away, and I wouldn't want to let my nic be out of the freezer for that long back and fourth from home. They also have an open-front laminar hood I'd love to be able to use for sterility.
My basement is a possible option, but the ceiling tiles are asbestos, and really old (80+ years). I don't even play music down there so I don't inhale the dust that falls
I am a stickler for safety. But I live in a small row-home. I don't really have the space to set up a lab the way I'd like. Maybe if I could clean out my garage, but that would be an unbelievably long process. Any ideas on how to get a work station set up with limited space? There's a lab I used to work at in Jersey that I'd be able to get work done, but it's an hour away, and I wouldn't want to let my nic be out of the freezer for that long back and fourth from home. They also have an open-front laminar hood I'd love to be able to use for sterility.
My basement is a possible option, but the ceiling tiles are asbestos, and really old (80+ years). I don't even play music down there so I don't inhale the dust that falls
Hey now, don't be dissing anarchists.
The way our gov't is going lately, I'm thinking very seriously that anarchy may be the only sensible way to go. Pretty sure my husband agrees; he's started buying ammo. But I agree about the "clean air" argument, since there really is no such thing anymore -- except in a lab!
There's nothing inherently unhealthy about inhaling vapor composed of PG and VG, they're quite inert, though they may irritate various people in various ways -- more than about 16% VG and I can't breathe at all, it glues my airways closed. Nicotine is a dead horse that is STILL being beat to death, but is beginning to seem more healthy than not. My only real question is about the flavors -- I don't think that all flavors are always bad, heck I use 30% flavoring in my ADV! But there are some ingredients in flavors that are probably best not inhaled, and diketones may be just the tip of that iceberg; right now we don't have much data, and the data we do have about diketones may or may not actually pertain to anyone outside a popcorn factory. So I shop very carefully for flavors, and exclude any diketones that are known about, just because the *potential* outcome of inhaling them is so dire. For the rest... like everyone else, I'll have to wait and see. I'm not about to throw out the baby with the bathwater, because highly-flavored ejuice is necessary for me to be happy with vaping -- which is a necessary condition for me to stay happily smoke-free.But the FDA? Doesn't really have much of a clue about anything; all they care about is MONEY. I'd really like to see them completely dissolved, and a new agency in their place -- comprised of those who have NEVER worked in Big Pharma in any capacity, and legally excluding anyone who ever has. It's just too incestuous, and bound to breed corruption, in its current composition.
Andria
I just use a kitchen counter -- if it's safe to make food, it's safe enough for ejuice. I don't think sterility is really necessary, unless you're making ejuice to sell to others; PG is hostile to microbes, which is probably why Hon Lik first settled on it as a good medium for vaping.
If I had a basement with asbestos tiles, I'd probably barricade it completely.
I was dismayed recently to learn that one of the elementary schools I attended (for 3 yrs) was torn down because of asbestos tiles. 
But I'd venture to guess that that 3 yr exposure didn't do me half the damage as the 39 yrs of smoking. So I vote for kitchen ejuice... if it's safe enough for food prep, it's safe enough for ejuice. And that way you have quick access to the freezer nicotine, and a sink for cleanups.
Andria
+1 on kitchen juice. 2 sq ft of counter space next to the sink is plenty. No need for a hood or lab coat or autoclave or any of that. Wash your mixing gear when you are done with it and store it in ziploc baggies to keep dust and such out of it. Think of it more like bartending than some sort of science experiment.
Think of it more like bartending than some sort of science experiment.
My house was built in the 20's, so I've got asbestos tiles and insulation, lead paint, and formaldehyde in my carpets. But that's how it goes in an old city. My wife taught at a school that was built in 1929. They closed down the top floor because of dead rats and piles of asbestos. And they just painted over the lead paint last year. The building won't be torn down until a natural disaster does it first. So I'm stuck with what I've got.
My solution to the FDA problem is to dissolve them, but to ban all lobbying. I'm an environmentalist, and would absolutely sacrifice my side if it would stop tobacco, pharma, the NRA, etc from buying politicians. We'd finally start to see policy decisions get made on the fact rather than whose money roll is bigger.
My Kitchen is pretty small. The only counter space I have is an 8 inch cabinet between my fridge and stove. That leaves my kitchen table. Not ideal, but if I clean it off, I may be ale to get it into workable order.
Also, how much do you guys usually make in 1 batch, and how long does it take you. My dogs love to play rough, and need to play right on top of me. I'd have to leave them locked upstairs. But I don't want to have to do it for too long
My solution to the FDA problem is to dissolve them, but to ban all lobbying. I'm an environmentalist, and would absolutely sacrifice my side if it would stop tobacco, pharma, the NRA, etc from buying politicians. We'd finally start to see policy decisions get made on the fact rather than whose money roll is bigger.
My Kitchen is pretty small. The only counter space I have is an 8 inch cabinet between my fridge and stove. That leaves my kitchen table. Not ideal, but if I clean it off, I may be ale to get it into workable order.
Also, how much do you guys usually make in 1 batch, and how long does it take you. My dogs love to play rough, and need to play right on top of me. I'd have to leave them locked upstairs. But I don't want to have to do it for too long
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