How efficient are e-cigarettes at nicotine delivery?

[TWISTED VICTOR]

Well Thank you for the referal and I managed quite a few pages but I still dont think I found the answer yet aside from one that might not exist8-oI sure hope thats not the answer. I will keep reading and hoping. Thanks,
Phil

Hi, phillyd. I have no doubt, if you stay with it, you'll see youself in many of these posts. Just like you, I had successfully quit analogs and for a while things seemed pretty ok. But after about a month I started feeling like something was missing. I was vaping plenty high nic and cravings were well under control, but I felt I was craving something more. Lung hit? Yes, but more than that I was craving the relaxation and mind cleariing focus I associated with the lung hit precursor, not the hit itself. Why was I not more relaxed? Why was I struggling to keep my mind on the work at hand? I was getting enough nic, it seemed, to sedate a horse and on a regular basis I vaped to the point of drowsy nausia. Eventially anxiety and depression had the upper hand and all because I no longer smoke cigarettes. How could this be if I was still getting the nic? The "Are we getting it..." thread goes through a long series of testimonies as to "why was I ok, now I'm not" and ends up with proof of what's missing and where to find it. You may need to do more experimentation with higher nic, higher voltage or other methods, but what I think I see in your post is someone, like many of us, who has an itch that the stripped down nicotine molecule alone doesn't scratch. Good luck in your quest and I hope a nic or power adjustment will be all that's needed for complete satisfaction, but if not, that thread will be much more meaningful to you .

 

[phillyd]

Hi, phillyd. I have no doubt, if you stay with it, you'll see youself in many of these posts. Just like you, I had successfully quit analogs and for a while things seemed pretty ok. But after about a month I started feeling like something was missing. I was vaping plenty high nic and cravings were well under control, but I felt I was craving something more. Lung hit? Yes, but more than that I was craving the relaxation and mind cleariing focus I associated with the lung hit precursor, not the hit itself. Why was I not more relaxed? Why was I struggling to keep my mind on the work at hand? I was getting enough nic, it seemed, to sedate a horse and on a regular basis I vaped to the point of drowsy nausia. Eventially anxiety and depression had the upper hand and all because I no longer smoke cigarettes. How could this be if I was still getting the nic? The "Are we getting it..." thread goes through a long series of testimonies as to "why was I ok, now I'm not" and ends up with proof of what's missing and where to find it. You may need to do more experimentation with higher nic, higher voltage or other methods, but what I think I see in your post is someone, like many of us, who has an itch that the stripped down nicotine molecule alone doesn't scratch. Good luck in your quest and I hope a nic or power adjustment will be all that's needed for complete satisfaction, but if not, that thread will be much more meaningful to you .

I see what you mean, the calming effect and all are not there. So what did you do? Go back to cigarettes or quit everything all together or do you just deal with it?

 

[olderthandirt]

I see what you mean, the calming effect and all are not there. So what did you do? Go back to cigarettes or quit everything all together or do you just deal with it?

Hi folks, hey Twisted
philly, I'm one o' those tortured souls in the Are we getting thread that TV had you look at. Just wanted to jump in real quick to say that I started using snus, Swedish snus, not that Camel joke from RJR, and that's what took care of the missing factor for me.

I still use the PV but now it truly does take on the role of the relaxation aspect.

Snus covers the nic and MAOI aspects and the PV offers up the meditative side of smoking. Slow drags, feel the throat and lung hit, watch and feel the vapor curl up my face, blow the vape rings, all in an unhurried and reflective fashion.

If this sparks any interest take a gander through the Smokeless Tobacco forum.

 

[phillyd]

Hi folks, hey Twisted
philly, I'm one o' those tortured souls in the Are we getting thread that TV had you look at. Just wanted to jump in real quick to say that I started using snus, Swedish snus, not that Camel joke from RJR, and that's what took care of the missing factor for me.

I still use the PV but now it truly does take on the role of the relaxation aspect.

Snus covers the nic and MAOI aspects and the PV offers up the meditative side of smoking. Slow drags, feel the throat and lung hit, watch and feel the vapor curl up my face, blow the vape rings, all in an unhurried and reflective fashion.

If this sparks any interest take a gander through the Smokeless Tobacco forum.

Ok thanks Dirt. I never was big on chew or anything like that. That means going back to tobacco. I really need to just quit I guess. I will keep vaping for now with what I have but like I said before, I don't want to start throwing a lot of money at this with mods and all kinds of juices where it defeating the whole purpose of quitting smoking and saving. I mean this was supposed to be a cheaper and healthier way to smoke right? If I have to go back to tobacco (snus) then I might as well just smoke and be satisfied I will stick with it and hopefully just ween off of nicotine. Thanks for everyones Help, Phil

 

[TWISTED VICTOR]

Ok thanks Dirt. I never was big on chew or anything like that. That means going back to tobacco. I really need to just quit I guess. I will keep vaping for now with what I have but like I said before, I don't want to start throwing a lot of money at this with mods and all kinds of juices where it defeating the whole purpose of quitting smoking and saving. I mean this was supposed to be a cheaper and healthier way to smoke right? If I have to go back to tobacco (snus) then I might as well just smoke and be satisfied I will stick with it and hopefully just ween off of nicotine. Thanks for everyones Help, Phil

Hey, Phillyd, don't get ready to throw in the towel, yet . First, I'd give the thread a good read through and make sure of what you're after. If so, consider a little exploration. You might surprise yourself. Not saying smokeless 'baccy's for you, but the greatest danger in smoking is the smoke .

 

[phillyd]

Hey, Phillyd, don't get ready to throw in the towel, yet . First, I'd give the thread a good read through and make sure of what you're after. If so, consider a little exploration. You might surprise yourself. Not saying smokeless 'baccy's for you, but the greatest danger in smoking is the smoke .

No I'm not throwin in the towel just yet and I will read more of the thread. But I am definately not going for any smokeless or tobacco products either. I would like to think that I quit smoking using an E-Cig and it was a very positive and successfull experience The greatest danger in chewing is "the chew" lol sarcasim inserted
Thankyou Victor

 

[TWISTED VICTOR]

No I'm not throwin in the towel just yet and I will read more of the thread. But I am definately not going for any smokeless or tobacco products either. I would like to think that I quit smoking using an E-Cig and it was a very positive and successfull experience The greatest danger in chewing is "the chew" lol sarcasim inserted
Thankyou Victor

Good enough . So, makes me ponder...if we quit smoking to vape, we're quiters, if we quit vaping to smoke, we're quiters, if we quit everything, we're quiters and if we decide to hang up quiting anything, we're still quiters .

 

[phillyd]

Good enough . So, makes me ponder...if we quit smoking to vape, we're quiters, if we quit vaping to smoke, we're quiters, if we quit everything, we're quiters and if we decide to hang up quiting anything, we're still quiters .

Well Ya But we will be positively healthy quitters. The same as I quit drinking 3 1/2yrs ago. Theres nothing wrong with quitting if thats what you want to do. I always said that I wanted to quit smoking after I quit drinking, but I was afraid to let go because I also liked it too, to some extent. I just never knew how to quit smoking or drinking until I was in the middle of it. Funny how that goes because I never planned either I was thrown into quitting alcohol because of my Wife and cigarettes were because I wanted to try one of these e-cigs and then one day I was out of smokes and said screw it I'm not going to buy anymore. Thank God for my 510 cuz I would have never imagined me ever quitting smokes.
Also I want to thank you and everyone else for this forum and what a great help it has been

 

[TropicalBob]

PhiL: OMG, snus is not chew. Snus has a 300-year history of safe use in Sweden. You simply must read the studies on snus. Do not even use the two tobacco products in the same sentence. Totally different products.

On charts ranking health hazards, snus is below e-cigarettes. Less dangerous. And that's easy to understand once you become familiar with snus, its processing, its history, its use. Dissolvables are likewise ranked safer on charts presented in Congressional testimony.

Only a tobacco product at present will provide you with the chemicals you are missing in nicotine-containing e-liquid. Those are what you crave. If you continue to deny your brain access to them, prepare for increasing difficulty in staying off cigarettes.

There is medical evidence now that some people's brains are "hard-wired" permanently by a long-standing addiction to cigarette smoking. The only hope for them is to restore balance with the missing chemicals they are hard-wired to need. Snus does that. E-liquid does not.

The best choice is using more than one alternative. For me, it's heavy reliance on snus, Java Stonewall and e-smoking, with daily use also of nasal snuff and a non-inhaled pipe. Find the route that fits you, but for goodness sakes don't toss out the one solution that helped Sweden achieve the lowest male smoking rate, and lowest lung cancer rate, in Europe.

 

[Connman]

Great thread. Helps me and seems to be darn close to my nic fix trials at 24mg juice. Which actually surprises me since I was a non-filter camel one pack a day smoker till the price increases which just chased me off to rolling my own.

I still get a craving for that cig but while I start the rolling process I hit the e-cig then put the tobacco back away. The most I have smoked since the 510 arrived in a day were 3 and now it has reached the one cig a day stage. Non today yet but the last craving ended up sitting in front of me rolled already. Think I should also invest in a lock box to stick the tobacco in. Additional steps to getting it in my hand.

I love a good laugh and this group is very informative and fun to read at the same time.

 

[kinabaloo]

PhiL: OMG, snus is not chew. ... Do not even use the two tobacco products in the same sentence. Totally different products.

On charts ranking health hazards, snus is below e-cigarettes. Less dangerous.

Care to summarise the 'why'? The why chew and snus are different, and why snus believed safer than e-liquid (sounds unlikely).

 

[Poeia]

So the 2-part formula for maintaining the same amount of nicotine you got when you were on analogs is

(nicotine per analog x # of analogs) / 0.4 = liquid mg per day

liquid mg per day / mg in liquid = milliliters needed per day

I just ordered my first e-cig. Based on that, the liquid I bought is waaaaay to low in nicotine (unless I can vape 23 milliliters a day.) Fortunately I have lots of unused Nicorette that I can use to supplement it while I find the right ratio for me.

 

[Poeia]

There's no way to editan additional thought onto our posts, is there?

It occurs to me that one thing that isn't taken into consideration is how many puffs you actually used to take on your analogs. At work, standing outside and holding the cigarette, I basically smoke the whole thing. But at home I light a cig, take a puff and put it in an ashtray. There are plenty of times when I only get a couple of puffs before the cigarette burns out.

With e-cigarettes, you get that 40% of the nicotine in all the juice.

 

[Stubby]

Care to summarise the 'why'? The why chew and snus are different, and why snus believed safer than e-liquid (sounds unlikely).

Snus and chew are processed in different ways. Two major ones are; The tobacco in snus is air cured as opposed to fire cured. This keeps the toxins at low levels. Second, snus is pasteurized as opposed to fermented. Again, this keeps the toxins associated with tobacco to very low levels.

There are a number of experts in the field of harm reduction that claim american snuff has improved in recent years and now there is little difference in harm between american snuff and Swedish snus. That could certainly be debated, but most that have used both prefer snus for various reasons, especially the fact that there is no need to spit.

It's not to difficult to figure out why some would consider snus to be less harmful then e-liquid. It's all about knowns and unknowns. Snus has been studied since the 60's and the degree of risk is well understood. With e-liquid there are to many unknowns to be so self-assured. E-liquid may very well end up being less harmful then snus (though it would likely be splitting hairs) but for the moment, if you want to stay with the knowns then snus has a good case going for it. You can agree or disagree with that but it's hard to argue with the decades of studies behind snus that show it is orders or magnitude less harmful then smoking.

 

[TWISTED VICTOR]

I love a good laugh and this group is very informative and fun to read at the same time.

Puuuph....just caught this. Go to the Smokeless Tobacco forum and read Dredbull's snus and snuff reviews.....you'll laugh yourself brain dead....

 

[a2dcovert]

How come I'm just finding this thread? Besides being another difficult read, it does make a lot of good points.

We need some concrete findings amnd solutions. I feel that we are already starting to lose some of the older members, as in length of time spent vaping not age, and I think they may need to be given this information before they give up and return to smoking. I know that I was at wits end before findinnng this forum. I think snus will keep me off cigarettes until a solution is found.

 

[TWISTED VICTOR]

I think it'll keep you off smokes, too. And I also agree that many an old timer has drifted the direction the smoke blows. There's so much info posted just recently, but the majority don't venture down to this area. All the music and eye-candy of the modders sub is sidetracking needy vapers. It would be nice to have a compilation from the brains and researchers as a sticky summary up there some where. It would be a community service for many.

 

[a2dcovert]

I think it'll keep you off smokes, too. And I also agree that many an old timer has drifted the direction the smoke blows. There's so much info posted just recently, but the majority don't venture down to this area. All the music and eye-candy of the modders sub is sidetracking needy vapers. It would be nice to have a compilation from the brains and researchers as a sticky summary up there some where. It would be a community service for many.

I posted an invite on the diyliquid forum hoping to catch the eye of some folks like us. I think the word needs to get out that nicotine from the PV is not going to work for us addicted smokers. I know that there are a lot of vapers who are still on that denial routine that I was on. "This has to work, I must need more nic content". TB said that the success rate for the PV will be more like 20% and I agree. There are probably lots of suffering vapers out there. We need to reach out to them.