EU law ruins everything! or does it?

[evan le'garde]

It's like a cull isn't it !?. A united Europe trying to kill off millions of people with toxic chemicals. I feel like we are being bottle necked into a new era of legalized genocide.

I can remember some European power doing this about 75 years ago, with great success i might add !.

Weird how history repeats itself. Maybe they'll have better luck this time round eh. And instead of other nations joining together to fight off this attack they are actually helping them make it happen.

It's an economic war on a level we've never experienced before. They just can't see or refuse to see what they are actually doing to the human population. A pivotal point in economic history which will be remembered forever.

Interesting to watch...........From a distance !

 

[sofarsogood]

Almost all the hardware comes from China but most of the liquids are mixed locally or nationally. To make liquid for most vapers you need nic. On May 20 who will be allowed to buy nic concentrate for mixing and who won't and how will they decide who can and cannot? Any vaper in Europe who doesn't have nic the freezer has a screw loose.

 

[Steamix]

Money. As always. Tobacco tax is a cash cow, upward of 10.000.000.000 Euros annually for each of the larger EU countries.
First vapers. Quirky fellas sucking on small metal tubes. A fad, a niche product. Or so they thought. Till sales started picking up steam. Tax rake dropped and all these fancy and largely useless nic patches, sprays, chewing gums, etc. gathered dust on the shelves of the pharmacies all over the globe while the Chinese were cranking up production as fast as they could.
Check some of the banners here - like x days not smoked amounts to y dollars/euros not spent. Multiply by a few million vapers and you'll see that vaping goes right for the jugular of the established players. Being established already also means they know exactly how and where to put the squeeze on legislative bodies ( aka lobbying ).
As advertising for cigarettes is either banned outright or severely curtailed in many countries, they got money to spare. To launch a disinformation campaign. Big lies, small lies, half truths, you name it. The inclusion of vaping in the TPD of the EU is the fruit of their efforts to slam a lid on that vaping thing.

Leak-proof, child-proof delivery system, refills the same, max 10ml at max 20mg/ml. Hastily slopped together and ill-conceived. But it passed and has to be adopted into national law by the end of this month. Some countries leave at the minimum the can get away with, some will put even more flesh on the bones.

Hardware isn't the real worry. A liquid gets heated. Happens in millions of household every day. Pour a liquid on a hot plate and you get vapor.. Not very portable. But switching the whole of the EU to cold food ... not in this lifetime ...

So the rub is the nicotine. Everything else is gettable. Just too many applications for PG and VG and flavours that got nothing to do with vaping. Eventually, they WILL tax it ( Italy already does ), as they're hurtin for that dosh,
but how and when plus all the not-so- little bueraeucratic buggery to keep them pencil-pushers happy...hard to say.

Remedy : Do like most vapers do. Stock up. Then stock up some more. There's a good numbr of threads here about that. So by the time they finally worked it into applicable valid law, you're set and they can sit - on your extend middle finger...

 

[sofarsogood]

Money. As always. Tobacco tax is a cash cow, upward of 10.000.000.000 Euros annually for each of the larger EU countries.
First vapers. Quirky fellas sucking on small metal tubes. A fad, a niche product. Or so they thought. Till sales started picking up steam. Tax rake dropped and all these fancy and largely useless nic patches, sprays, chewing gums, etc. gathered dust on the shelves of the pharmacies all over the globe while the Chinese were cranking up production as fast as they could.
Check some of the banners here - like x days not smoked amounts to y dollars/euros not spent. Multiply by a few million vapers and you'll see that vaping goes right for the jugular of the established players. Being established already also means they know exactly how and where to put the squeeze on legislative bodies ( aka lobbying ).
As advertising for cigarettes is either banned outright or severely curtailed in many countries, they got money to spare. To launch a disinformation campaign. Big lies, small lies, half truths, you name it. The inclusion of vaping in the TPD of the EU is the fruit of their efforts to slam a lid on that vaping thing.

Leak-proof, child-proof delivery system, refills the same, max 10ml at max 20mg/ml. Hastily slopped together and ill-conceived. But it passed and has to be adopted into national law by the end of this month. Some countries leave at the minimum the can get away with, some will put even more flesh on the bones.

Hardware isn't the real worry. A liquid gets heated. Happens in millions of household every day. Pour a liquid on a hot plate and you get vapor.. Not very portable. But switching the whole of the EU to cold food ... not in this lifetime ...

So the rub is the nicotine. Everything else is gettable. Just too many applications for PG and VG and flavours that got nothing to do with vaping. Eventually, they WILL tax it ( Italy already does ), as they're hurtin for that dosh,
but how and when plus all the not-so- little bueraeucratic buggery to keep them pencil-pushers happy...hard to say.

Remedy : Do like most vapers do. Stock up. Then stock up some more. There's a good numbr of threads here about that. So by the time they finally worked it into applicable valid law, you're set and they can sit - on your extend middle finger...

Something hopeful happened a few days ago. The Royal College of Physicians weighed in. They've been around for 500 years. Their 200 page report boils down to this, vaping is good, science is not the issue. They are right of course and everybody knows they are right. So now we can have the bareknuckle political brawl everybody is spoiling for. Lots of shouting and cursiing and demonstrating and all that good stuff.

 

[JCinFLA]

Now days I mostly use ego
type batteries with iclear 16 clearomizers. I still use kr808d form factor hardware. I have been vaping almost three years. I am doing fine.

Yea! Thought I was one of only a very few who still used eGo batteries and some of the older Innokin clearos sometimes. Have a bunch of the 1100mAh batts, some 650's, & some 450's stashed. Still use them for friends, relatives, etc. who want to try to switch to vaping, too. I really like the little 450's, especially for stealth vaping!

I think the 16D clearos are great, and I use them probably 90% of the time! Have 15 of them and 12 boxes of their coils in my stash, too.

Like you also...I've been vaping awhile (2 1/2 years), and I'm doing fine, too! I have a stash also of more powerful and/or advanced mods and tanks, but I still love the "old" hardware, too. Newer, more advanced, isn't always necessarily better IMO.

 

[daviedog]

It is affected in someway - you won't be able to vape it on a 4 ml tank i guess... and thats *******!

Buy 2 two milliliter tanks. That'll show em..

 

[daviedog]

It's like a cull isn't it !?. A united Europe trying to kill off millions of people with toxic chemicals. I feel like we are being bottle necked into a new era of legalized genocide.

I can remember some European power doing this about 75 years ago, with great success i might add !.

Weird how history repeats itself. Maybe they'll have better luck this time round eh. And instead of other nations joining together to fight this attack off they are actually helping them make it happen.

It's an economic war on a level we've never experienced before. They just can't see or refuse to see what they are actually doing to the human population. A pivotal point in economic history which will be remembered forever.

Interesting to watch...........From a distance !

Yes, history repeats itself. But the world learns & implements a neo history with subtlety, tact, mirrors..

 

[Falconeer]

Nicotine isn't being totally banned - the strongest solution that can be sold is 20 strength though...unless you know a wee man with a fast boat from the other side of the Med!

20 strength still goes a long way in DIY.

A black market will however result.

 

[Troll from behind]

It's funny how far EU has come from its founding principles of free trade & movement across borders within EU.
For seasoned vaping vets with stocks bussines as usual but for the millions of smokers this is a potential deathblow.
Saves money in the long run, lung cancer isn't that expensive way to go.

 

[Steamix]

Something hopeful happened a few days ago. The Royal College of Physicians weighed in. They've been around for 500 years. Their 200 page report boils down to this, vaping is good, science is not the issue. They are right of course and everybody knows they are right. So now we can have the bareknuckle political brawl everybody is spoiling for. Lots of shouting and cursiing and demonstrating and all that good stuff.

Good thing they did.

EU will always claim that of course they aren't banning it - they'll just a 'regulate it a bit'.
EU is also regulating the curvature angle of bananas. So you can wager that this self perpetuating monster known as bureaucracy will take a ahold of vaping with a vengeance.

But their report could certainly help matters in countries where vaping has been banned outright.

So let's see what Brussels got in store for us :

- PMTA light. Analysis of emissions and all that. Pretty vague. Have to see how that pans out in the final fine print.

- Adults only. Am good on that one. Gets implemented by online vendors in the EU already. Age verification upon ordering and upon delivery. Law catching up with reality. Don't know of any B&M anywhere not carding customers if in doubt.

- Child-proof. Sure. But call it child-resistant. Better. Ask any parent with an inquisitive toddler, there is no such thing as child-proof

- Leak-proof. Same. Fine with it. But how do you define it. If I clobber a steel tank long enough and hard enough, it will eventually spring a leak. Perfect opportunity for narrow-minded pencil pushers to get their 15 minutes.

- 20 mg/ml maximum nicotine content. Seeing that sub-ohming that is something one tries only once, no sweat Hardcore tootle puffers might be a bit put off, but the sub-ohming crowd won't even notice, I guess.

- 10 ml maximum for refill. Now that's utter BS. On one hand they're lamenting about the ever-increasing percentage of plastic waste that's hard to recycle and takes centuries to decompose, on the other hand they're writing a rule that would add to the problem significantly. I see nothing wrong with 100ml glass bottles for instance. Infrastructure to recycle glass is there - 's been done for decades.

- Flavours. Some EU members made noises about that already. Severly restricting what flavours can and cannot go into a liquid. Looking closer it's obvious: our special interest group still hard at work trying to make that what's allowed as unattractive as possible. DIY will get another boost as consequence. Especially if you like to vape a flavour which they don't like you to like. Flavours suspended in PG are also used by the food processing industry by the wagonload. DIY.DIY. And dear EU : GFY

- Additives. Like vitamins, coffeine, taurin, what have you. If I want coffeine, I get me a nice mug of freshly brewed. Even one these atrocious concictions in a papercup off some franchised lame excuse for quality will do in a pinch. For vitamins, take a bite out of an apple ( no, not your iphone - I mean that roundish thing ladies hand to men to get them into serious trouble ). Or a mango. Or whatever else grows in your end of the world.
In case you didn't look or listen, Mr/Mrs EU : vaping community heaped and still heaps shame and flame on those shady vendors lacing the liquids with all sorts of fancy additives to make tall ( health ) claims. Vapers themselves said outright that vaping isn't healthy, but a LOT less unhealthy then smoking. Unfortunately for you, we are not as stupid as you would like us to have. Sorry for that. NOT

- Advertising and vape-talk. If they had their way, a forum like ECF or any other vaper forum would technically be illegal. That - I expect - would be one of the first things to get sunk in court. Freedom of speech is a principle held very high. For a good reason. Web is full of all sorts of -ists ( racists, sexists, terrosists, etc ) spreading their mental garbage largely unchecked. And you wanna put a gag on vapers. Seriously ?!

But - on a personal vent ( feel free to stop reading here ) ...

No matter how vaping will look in the future - it's here to stay. And it served as a catalyst to many members of the vaping community to take a closer look at the machinations of their respective ruling bodies.
We're learning that some quarters have no qualms whatsoever consigning a huge number of people to an early demise in favour of their balance sheets.

EU is a nice idea - but it's about to get suffocated under mountains of paperwork by pathetic little bureaucrats who are forgetting that they're supposed to act as a counterweight to a no-holds-barred Big Greed. Instead, I feel we're getting sold out to. Democracy. Sure. As long as it doesn't put too much of a dent in the profits, we'll indulge it. Apart from that - corporate state, neo-feudalism not based on bloodlines but on credit lines...

Tinfoil hat or no tinfoil hat - I think we're getting shafted ( not just the vaping community ). Big time.

Rant over - thank you.

Vape on

 

[suprtrkr]

Government will do that to you. Here in the US we say "your tax dollars at work."

 

[JokkeD86]

thanks for all the answers folks