Toxicology Report

[Greg]

Hello all . I'm currently awaiting the arrival of my first e-cig and have spent the best part of the last week researching this forum- following a path well trodden by many of you I assume!

I am interested to know, given the unknown long term health risks of e-smoking, if an e-liquid would still deliver nicotine effectively to the user if it consisted simply of pure water, pure alcohol, and pure nicotine. I understand that PROPYLENE GLYCOL and VEGETABLE GLYCERIN (and other similar chemicals) produce the visible vapour so desired by e-smokers, but if the user was willing to sacrafice this in the interests of safety, albeit a perceived interest, then would such an e-liquid still function as an effective means of providing an e-smoker with nicotine via an e-cig? Furthermore, if such a liquid was feasible, and would in fact work as a means if delivering nicotine, would e-smokers see the lack of vapour as being an unacceptable loss of the "smoking" experience?

Apologies in advance if my question is answered elsewhere

 

[Kate]

Those seem more like ingredients in cigs to me DC.

I'm not sure that steam would be as satisfying but don't know if it would work or not Greg. I've not heard of anyone trying it.

 

[Greg]

Hello all . I'm currently awaiting the arrival of my first e-cig and have spent the best part of the last week researching this forum- following a path well trodden by many of you I assume!

I am interested to know, given the unknown long term health risks of e-smoking, if an e-liquid would still deliver nicotine effectively to the user if it consisted simply of pure water, pure alcohol, and pure nicotine. I understand that PROPYLENE GLYCOL and VEGETABLE GLYCERIN (and other similar chemicals) produce the visible vapour so desired by e-smokers, but if the user was willing to sacrafice this in the interests of safety, albeit a perceived interest, then would such an e-liquid still function as an effective means of providing an e-smoker with nicotine via an e-cig? Furthermore, if such a liquid was feasible, and would in fact work as a means if delivering nicotine, would e-smokers see the lack of vapour as being an unacceptable loss of the "smoking" experience?

Apologies in advance if my question is answered elsewhere

 

[dc2k08]

I see some of them referred to in that ingredients thread you linked to but not Acetaldehyde, Acetone, Acrolein, Acrylonitrile, Anthracene, Formaldehyde, Pyrene, Styrene.

So what is that report about?

• ingredients that are in e-liquid
• ingredients that are in tobacco
• ingredients that are in e-liquid, tobacco or both
• ingredients that were just chosen sort of randomly

Reading his intro, it seems he is worried about "tobacco essence" and what it might possibly contain if it is not extracted correctly and therefore these ingredients that he mentions might possibly be in e-liquid. well that's what I make of it. If Dr L or PB's tests did not find any of these ingredients, and Trumpy says 90% of e-liquid comes from the Ruyan's manufacturers, should we just disregard the ingredients that don't show in their lists and just be concerned about other types ?

 

[smoking gnu]

The tobacco essence is one that is being implicated as a possible danger and others. Apparently if its not pure enough it is said it could do more harm than actually smoking.
Now that would be ironic.
The student who wrote it is not actually qualified. LOL but he might be right .

 

[yvilla]

I see some of them referred to in that ingredients thread you linked to but not Acetaldehyde, Acetone, Acrolein, Acrylonitrile, Anthracene, Formaldehyde, Pyrene, Styrene.

So what is that report about?

dc, some of them are reported as being present in vapor, in extremely small amounts, in Dr. Laugesen's study. I believe that's why Satire included them in his report, although the Dr. did not appear to be too concerned about them. Trumpy gave the link to the Dr.'s study a few posts above, but I'll include it again:

http://healthnz.co.nz/RuyanCartridgeReport21-Oct-08.pdf

 

[dc2k08]

I see, so he does have Acetaldehyde, Acetone, Formaldehyde, Styrene, Perylene, Methyl phenanthrene and others listed as being contained in some part in the cartridges.

Acetaldehyde is the chemical in some mouthwashes that they recently linked to cancer.

 

[Kate]

... there goes the myth of no carcinogens?

 

[Trumpybloke]

ok seriously , the ONLY healthier way of smoking is quitting LOL
Dc its hard to pin down all the users by product name but the major source company is in Shenzhen Guandong province they source the nic locally but will not divulge who , I suspect it is Shenzhen Jieshibao Technology Co., Ltd. , the major manufacturer using them is Farsee Technology Co Ltd... these are the guys who produce most of the e-cigs you will see Electronic Cigarette¦òCigar¦òMini E-cig¦òManufacturer

 

[smoking gnu]

This student says that the act of smoking tobacco cause less damage because the burning reduces the harmful effects of all the crap in the tobacco. Well I always believed that burning the dreaded weed was one of the best way to make it more deadly.
I’m getting far to tired to make much sense out of it I shall leave it for another day . Or better still leave it to somebody who will actually read it all, he he he.

 

[Kate]

Well there's certainly no point in worrying Gnu, healthy concern should be enough. Stress and worry are unhealthy too.

The fact is that our lungs are designed to be exposed to fresh air. We can find the most benign substances we know of but it's still not natural and will always present some risk.

 

[smoking gnu]

ok seriously , the ONLY healthier way of smoking is quitting LOL
Dc its hard to pin down all the users by product name but the major source company is in they source the nic locally but will not divulge who , I suspect it is Shenzhen Jieshibao Technology Co., Ltd. , the major manufacturer using them is Farsee Technology Co Ltd... these are the guys who produce most of the e-cigs you will see Electronic Cigarette¦òCigar¦òMini E-cig¦òManufacturer

Shenzhen Guandong province lovely we can add a bit of bird flu to the list as well, 8-ohe he he

 

[Trumpybloke]

I think this thread is fast going around in circles and will soon end up chasing its own tail WOOF WOOF !!!

Can I sum up my opinions LOL

Ok our ciggies DO contain nasties!
If we wanted to become truly healthy we would give up all processed and manufatured items and live in a cave ( is there a MSDS for spiders??? )

The amount of nasties present in the ONLY laboratory analysis I have had the priviledge of reading is miniscule and according to the chairman of NZ health is safe!! This man proposes to ban tobacco and would encourage the alternative use of e-cigs....

The largest exporter of e-fluids Royalsmokers has this to say

"Our liquid has undergone and passed toxicity testing by China's governmental safety officials. There should not be any harmful side-effects when used in accordance to the directions. A small percentage of e-liquid users are sensitive to propylene glycol, which is the main constituent of our Liquid and is also found in some soft drinks, popcorn, ice cream, and food coloring. It is also the "oil" that produces the steam or vapor in vaporizers and nebulizers. If you find that you are sensitive to propylene glycol, you should stop using our e-liquid and/or seek medical treatment."

In short I believe I am making a far healthier informed choice by vaping than I ever did when I took up smoking !!!
how many of us looked at toxicological reports before we bought our Marlboros?? LOL

Until our fluids are tested and regulated , we have NO WAY of knowing what is in them , just the same way we have no way of knowing what is in ice-cream ... its ingredients are allowed but by all conventional knowledge it contains a lot of the nasties we are talking about too ????

I guess it comes down to personal choice and faith, just like everything in this world ..... Lets not ruin it by over analysing and jumping to conclusions that might just be easily as disproved as proved

Here Endeth The Rant

 

[Trumpybloke]

Oh and Satire........... your two weeks of hard work has achieved monumental interest --- well done !!!!


(And to be reeeeeeeeeeeally nitpicky its toxicological not toxicology ROTFLMAO )

 

[smoking gnu]

Chicken fat is used to make some ice-cream, yum yum ! Trumpy you are right mate, e-liquids could be quite safe if manufactured correctly. We just have to make up our own minds.
Chinese manufactures have had their reputations questioned quite a bit on this forum, but I cant think of another country that has the death penalty for corporation bosses that poison people.

 

[Frankie]

Well, I for one do not eat 20 cones every day.

I really hope we can believe Royalsmokers and be happy. But... "China's governmental safety officials"... Does not sound too true...

 

[Frankie]

I cant think of another country that has the death penalty for corporation bosses that poison people.

It also has death penalty for forgery of a VAT return. (No joke. Long story. Translated this from a Chinese tax delegation... ) And they still forge them.

 

[Trumpybloke]

LOL well apples and oranges there frankie -- say you vape 2 ml a day---- how many ml is in an ice cream cone?? 2-300??? you would have to eat 10 bottles of e-liquid , and then the Nic will get ya , not the food additives....Thats just the point I am trying to say , its not the fact nasties are there , its the concentration of the nasties that counts and in what form they are presented ... lets not forget the most toxic compound in our liquid is actually the nicotine we crave... yet how many of us are saying helllllll thats a deadly poison --- lets get rid of it !!

 

[Kate]

... its not the fact nasties are there , its the concentration of the nasties that counts and in what form they are presented ...

That is my understanding of the tests Dr Laugesen carried out on the Ruyan samples. There were trace amounts of some toxins but not enough to cause concern.

 

[yvilla]

... there goes the myth of no carcinogens?

1) The Acetaldehyde in mouthwash linked to cancer in the recently released study is derived from the alcohol content in mouthwash. Alcohol is not a necessary ingredient in e-cig liquid, although is present in some.

2) The referenced study is, of course, awash in dispute in any event.
Link between mouthwash and oral cancer in dispute