Insanely Outrageous Claims of Underage Use in Utah

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AgentAnia

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The thread title is quoted from this blog article: Insanely Outrageous Claims of Underage Use in Utah

Here's the article he refers to: http: //www . abc4. com/content/news/top_stories/story/More-Kids-Using-E-Cigarettes/BOJX12ivm0ikA3kN9wjsNA.cspx

A study by the Prevention Need Assessment surveyed kids back in 2011 and found an alarming trend. One in 20 Utah kids has tried electronic cigarettes. And experts say it’s against the law and could lead kids down a dangerous path.

I checked the Utah 2011 Prevention Need Assessment (http://www.dsamh.utah.gov/docs/State of Utah Profile Report.pdf) and could find no mention at all of electronic cigarettes! tobacco cigarette usage was surveyed, but not ecigs.

Unfortunately, neither could I find any way to post a comment to the ABC4 article.
 

Petrodus

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This article is a Piece of Garbage

Comment below the "so-called" article

I'm really getting tired of this half-a**ed reporting. What study, why isn't it linked? Big tobacco has virtually no presence in the e-cig market besides the recent acquisition of BLU. Adults like flavored juices. Why shouldn't I be able to vape caramel-apple because you're a crappy parent? Is cherry vodka blatantly targeted at kids? I really hope companies start suing idiots like the guy in the article and ABC for publishing such blatantly false information.
:laugh:
 

Vocalek

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Following the Contact Us link at the bottom of the screen, I sent a message to ABC4Utah General Manager:

The story "More Kids Using E-Cigarettes" contains several assertions that are not supported by the cited source. "A study by the Prevention Need Assessment surveyed kids back in 2011 and found an alarming trend. One in 20 Utah kids has tried electronic cigarettes." Another very questionable statement is "That same study also shows that 69% of kids who smoke regular cigarettes, started out smoking e-cigarettes." The referenced study does not even mention e-cigarettes. SHARP Youth Prevention, DSAMH

A retraction is in order.
 

Spazmelda

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This statement is even worse:

I read this earlier this morning, and I had meant to get on here and ask you (Elaine) specifically if you had seen this reference and if you knew WTH they were talking about. That seems like a completely outrageous statistic to me, and I can't see how it would possibly be right. I can't recall ever seeing a study or survey that even addressed such a question.
 

kristin

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After commenting on the article itself, I called the ABC 4 news desk and spoke with them about the inaccuracies in the report - most specifically the claim that the "same study also shows that 69% of kids who smoke regular cigarettes, started out smoking e-cigarettes." He agreed the claim was far different in meaning than their earlier story that stated "Utah students who used e-cigarettes were significantly more likely to smoke regular cigarettes than students who were not using e-cigarettes. The smoking rate for Utah students who used e-cigarettes was 69% compared to a 4% smoking rate among students who were not using e-cigarettes." (I emailed him the link to that earlier story while on the phone with him.) He said they would look into it further and took my CASAA information for future stories after I suggested they should be getting information from both sides. He also asked for a local rep, so I gave him the name of a very active member in Utah.

I also gave him correct info regarding the "experts" claims about "not knowing what is in them," "big tobacco is targeting our kids" and that the "wacky flavors" are just to target kids.

(I wrote it out so I wouldn't forget anything when I called):

1) "That same study shows that 69% of kids who are smokers, they started off by using e-cigarettes."

This is completely false. The study did NOT show that. Your own site states that the 2011 study found that "Utah students who used e-cigarettes were significantly more likely to smoke regular cigarettes than students who were not using e-cigarettes. The smoking rate for Utah students who used e-cigarettes was 69% compared to a 4% smoking rate among students who were not using e-cigarettes." That does not in any way mean that those students were non-smokers before using e-cigarettes. What that means is that 69% of youth who use e-cigarettes were smoking. It's logical that non-ecigarette users would also be mostly non-smokers. Because the survey hasn't been made public, it's impossible to know the whole story.

2) "Big tobacco is using these to target your kids."

Only one tobacco company currently sells e-cigarettes in the US. [Note: I forgot that Vuse is on the market now, so technically 2 tobacco companies sell e-cigs in the US. But if they want to be technical, at the time of the 2010 survey, NO tobacco company was selling e-cigarettes.] The vast majority of US companies are small, local business owners who have used the products to quit smoking themselves. [I'm referring to US brick & mortar stores and it's is purely anecdotal.]

3) "They are not FDA regulated, so we really do not know what are in them."

The FDA tested 2 brands in 2009 and found nothing that would actually harm someone. There are many tests and several studies available to show exactly what is in them. Since 2009, no study has found harmful levels of any toxins or carcinogens in e-cigarettes.

4) "Blatantly targeting kids with wacky flavors any kid would like."

CASAA's 2010 survey showed that only 16.7% of adult e-cigarette users exclusively use tobacco or menthol flavors. Over 51% used flavors such as chocolate, apple and orange. obviously, the non-tobacco flavors appeal just as much to adult smokers. Many users report that staying away from cigarette flavors significantly reduces the desire to smoke.

This is my comment on the actual article (may also answer some questions posted here):

This same station has recently reported on this (E Cigarettes - ABC4.com - Salt Lake City, Utah News) and it says “Utah students who used e-cigarettes were significantly more likely to smoke regular cigarettes than students who were not using e-cigarettes. The smoking rate for Utah students who used e-cigarettes was 69% compared to a 4% smoking rate among students who were not using e-cigarettes.”

Aside from being a ridiculous comparison (how about comparing the percentage of non-smoking youth using e-cigarettes to smoking youth using e-cigarettes, not the smoking rate between the two. It’s like saying “The obesity rate of youth using diet pills was 69% compared to a 4% obesity rate among students not using diet pills.”), all this tells us is that it’s smoking youth using e-cigarettes, not non-smoking youth.

Nowhere has it ever been said (except by this journalist) that the “69% of youth e-cigarette users” weren’t smoking before they started the e-cigarette use. It’s a misinterpretation (and misuse) of the statistics.

By the way, the study cited here was published without any information regarding e-cigarette use. CASAA investigated and discovered (by way of a Desert News journalist who published a story about it in 2011) that “the Division of Substance Abuse and Mental Health contracted with the SHARP survey operators, to ask additional questions in last year’s Personal Needs Assessment survey. Because they were questions that were not originally in the survey’s format, the data resulting from the answers is not included in the published SHARP survey. The department is working on publishing a separate study containing these numbers.”

We have yet to see that separate study published.
 
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AgentAnia

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Where do they Get this Stuff?

Sometimes I think if a Reporter had to Publish the Source of a Quoted Statistic, that 78.4%* of the Statistics Wouldn't be Quoted.


* I just made that Up. If they can Make Stuff Up, so can I.

Actually, the results of my survey* indicate that 99.67% of statistics could not be quoted if sources had to be published...

*Survey participants = 3. Me and 2 cats.
 

2coils

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After commenting on the article itself, I called the ABC 4 news desk and spoke with them about the inaccuracies in the report - most specifically the claim that the "same study also shows that 69% of kids who smoke regular cigarettes, started out smoking e-cigarettes." He agreed the claim was far different in meaning than their earlier story that stated "Utah students who used e-cigarettes were significantly more likely to smoke regular cigarettes than students who were not using e-cigarettes. The smoking rate for Utah students who used e-cigarettes was 69% compared to a 4% smoking rate among students who were not using e-cigarettes." (I emailed him the link to that earlier story while on the phone with him.) He said they would look into it further and took my CASAA information for future stories after I suggested they should be getting information from both sides. He also asked for a local rep, so I gave him the name of a very active member in Utah.

I also gave him correct info regarding the "experts" claims about "not knowing what is in them," "big tobacco is targeting our kids" and that the "wacky flavors" are just to target kids.

(I wrote it out so I wouldn't forget anything when I called):

1) "That same study shows that 69% of kids who are smokers, they started off by using e-cigarettes."

This is completely false. The study did NOT show that. Your own site states that the 2011 study found that "Utah students who used e-cigarettes were significantly more likely to smoke regular cigarettes than students who were not using e-cigarettes. The smoking rate for Utah students who used e-cigarettes was 69% compared to a 4% smoking rate among students who were not using e-cigarettes." That does not in any way mean that those students were non-smokers before using e-cigarettes. What that means is that 69% of youth who use e-cigarettes were smoking. It's logical that non-ecigarette users would also be mostly non-smokers. Because the survey hasn't been made public, it's impossible to know the whole story.

2) "Big tobacco is using these to target your kids."

Only one tobacco company currently sells e-cigarettes in the US. [Note: I forgot that Vuse is on the market now, so technically 2 tobacco companies sell e-cigs in the US. But if they want to be technical, at the time of the 2010 survey, NO tobacco company was selling e-cigarettes.] The vast majority of US companies are small, local business owners who have used the products to quit smoking themselves. [I'm referring to US brick & mortar stores and it's is purely anecdotal.]

3) "They are not FDA regulated, so we really do not know what are in them."

The FDA tested 2 brands in 2009 and found nothing that would actually harm someone. There are many tests and several studies available to show exactly what is in them. Since 2009, no study has found harmful levels of any toxins or carcinogens in e-cigarettes.

4) "Blatantly targeting kids with wacky flavors any kid would like."

CASAA's 2010 survey showed that only 16.7% of adult e-cigarette users exclusively use tobacco or menthol flavors. Over 51% used flavors such as chocolate, apple and orange. obviously, the non-tobacco flavors appeal just as much to adult smokers. Many users report that staying away from cigarette flavors significantly reduces the desire to smoke.

This is my comment on the actual article (may also answer some questions posted here):
The RIGHT people are leading the troops at CASAA. Thank you for your efforts. That explanation and clarification kicked some serious buttocks!!!
 

kristin

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Where do they Get this Stuff?

She misinterpreted (or purposely misrepresented) the meaning of "The smoking rate for Utah students who used e-cigarettes was 69% compared to a 4% smoking rate among students who were not using e-cigarettes.” (As I said earlier, a stupid comparison.)

All it states is that 69% of youth e-cigarette users smoked. Nowhere does it state that 69% of e-cig users were non-smokers who then graduated from e-cigarettes to smoking, but that is apparently what she got out of that statement!
 
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RosaJ

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She misinterpreted (or purposely misrepresented) the meaning of "The smoking rate for Utah students who used e-cigarettes was 69% compared to a 4% smoking rate among students who were not using e-cigarettes.” (As I said earlier, a stupid comparison.)

All it states is that 69% of youth e-cigarette users smoked. Nowhere does it state that 69% of e-cig users were non-smokers who then graduated to smoking, but that is apparently what she got out of that statement!

Obviously she must have flunked Reading Comprehension in school (if kids are being taught it at all these days)!
 
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