American E-Liquid Manufacturers' Standards Association launches

[TheBoogieman]

Problem is to people they are not minor points. You have people telling you to stop .....n that you have no right to complain about juice. You smoked and anything is better. You smoked something with 4000 chemical and now your worried about where your juice is made?

You have people that say the ecig industry is unregulated, they have to follow no standards. Which is true, but a poor excuse.

You have people saying that following standards will raise the juice prices. BS. JC is selling 30ml. bottles of juice for $20. Guy making juice in their house are selling juice for that price too.

You have people that think juice made in someone's house is fine. The next step up from that is people that think you just need a designated clean room. Others (and I would say the FDA) think juice should be made in a lab environment. There a guy making juice in his apt. here, someone asked for a picture of his lab. And got a picture of a table with bottles of nic and flavoring on it.

I've heard people ..... about child resistance bottle caps. No child resistance cap on my bottle of bleach, why on my nicotine juice. Hell theres a frickin child safety cap on my damn mouthwash. Heck if I even know why.....

List just goes on and on.

TheBoogieman

 

[metropolitan]

i know i'm asking for trouble by writing this here, but my basic beliefs regarding e-liquid manufacturing come down to the following:

e-liquid manufacturers should:
1. be willing to register company owner and address with the FDA, the way food producers have to
2. note batch/lot numbers on the packaging and keep records, the way food producers have to
3. list all ingredients, the way all food products do
4. be ready for possible inspection of premises the way food factories and restaurants get health inspections
5. test random batches for correct nicotine content and contaminants and make results public
6. package all retail products with child protective caps
7. have some liability insurance the way all food manufacturers that engage in interstate commerce have to
8. avoid marketing that can attract children or minors (i.e. no joe camel / spuds mckenzie mascots, etc.)

i don't think this is too far from the aemsa ideas and i don't think that's an unreasonable list.
i for one, am willing to pay more for my e-liquid if necessary. if there are already e-liquid manufacturers who follow my basic wish list above, please let me know and i will exclusively buy my liquid from them.

i was involved in a friend's artisinal gourmet condiment company from the beginning and i watched him go from him fixing the stuff in his kitchen (with a cat, while smoking cigarettes) to him using a commercial kitchen with a health inspection certificate (rented by the day), getting insurance, passing local and state health inspections, getting lab test for the acidity of his products, getting lab test for the nutritional label once his products started to sell out of state and so on.
in the early days he was terrified of having to go through all these steps and thought it was going to be the end of his little home business. he bit the bullet and went through it all and his business has been growing steadily. the big stores like Whole Foods wouldn't look at his product until he had the liability insurance in place. the cost of it? $1200 for a year. he's made more than that in profits from Whole Foods alone and his products are only in three of their stores.

i know it's a hassle to deal with these things and it's scary and daunting if you have never done it before, but it's relatively painless in the end and it was a necessity for his business to succeed.

 

[EddardinWinter]

everyone here on this thread (and board) is on the same team but it seems like much more time is spent finding minutia where people disagree as opposed to working harder at finding where they agree.
no final proposal will match anyone's perfect wish list but a certain consensus can be reached if people work a little harder on swallowing some pride at times and spend a little less time trying to outsmart each other on minor points.

I am not trying to outsmart anyone. I just want an answer to the questions:

1) Why do they do these things ?
2) If they are a dishonorable partner now, why will they change if/when we capitulate?

I also want to point out that if you are trying to build a consensus, calling people 'paranoid' and 'conspiracy theorists' for not trusting an organization (FDA) might not be the best way to go. This is particularly true when the organizations actions to date have exemplified by the sort of tactics I documented above. Even if it is paranoid, that doesn't make it untrue.

I am inclined to stand with the vendors and organizations who fight the FDA to protect their freedoms.

 

[TheBoogieman]

I never read or posted in 137 pages. Just came looking for information about them. They didn't just get on ECF. They were all over the place discussing their plans on every forum and vape show. I come here to find out that I'm not the only one wondering what that was all about. Told they are a trade association and are going to do for their members and not consumers.

Their association, their members, their businesses and their money. Every right to do what they want to do. But when I personally do what I want to do, I don't go around looking for peoples input on what I'm doing. I just to it.

Really have lost interest in this.....
Walking out of this thread like I walked in, scratching my head.

TheBoogieman

 

[Quick1]

Their association, their members, their businesses and their money. Every right to do what they want to do. But when I personally do what I want to do, I don't go around looking for peoples input on what I'm doing. I just to it.

Walking out of this thread like I walked in, scratching my head.

Now you have me scratching my head . What part are you disappointed with?
That they are a trade association (and not a consumer association)?
Or that they are looking for input?

 

[6pointprime]

Update on AEMSA meeting with the FDA:

http://www.aemsa.org/aemsafda-listening-session/

 

[DC2]

Update on AEMSA meeting with the FDA:

AEMSA/FDA

That is extremely fascinating.
It's unfortunate that the comments are closed.

 

[zoiDman]

Bump for Any New News.

 

[gotalotgoingon]

Who does the organization think they are? Meeting with the FDA to promote "their" standards? From what I gather, they are self elected and in no way represent me as a vapor.

 

[BuGlen]

Who does the organization think they are? Meeting with the FDA to promote "their" standards? From what I gather, they are self elected and in no way represent me as a vapor.

You are absolutely correct that they do not represent you as a vapor (or any of us for that matter). They are a trade organization, exactly the same as any other trade organization, consisting of a membership of manufacturers. Trade organizations are formed solely for the benefit and representation of their membership within a given segment of an industry. This has been (and still is) critical to the success of smaller industry segments when in competition with larger competing interests and corporations.

Do a little research on the history of trade organizations and you'll see the impact they've had on our economic growth in the past.

 

[Quick1]

Who does the organization think they are? Meeting with the FDA to promote "their" standards? From what I gather, they are self elected and in no way represent me as a vapor.

You need to get right on down there and meet with the FDA yourself then.

 

[6pointprime]

Who does the organization think they are? Meeting with the FDA to promote "their" standards? From what I gather, they are self elected and in no way represent me as a vapor.

You need to get right on down there and meet with the FDA yourself then.

This.

They represent their interests. If you have different interests, do something to make sure your voice is heard.