What is the consensus here on extremely sub ohm builds?

[supermarket]

It is not a shops responsibity or job to educate adult consumers on basic electronic safety.
It's a shops job to make a profit.
That is all a business does.

Oh.......I'm going to have to disagree with you ENTIRELY.

It is ABSOLUTELY the shop's job to participate in harm reduction......and part of that includes NOT selling dangerous items to people who seem completely unknowledable.

Are they required by LAW to check out each customer and participate in harm reduction? No. Are they "morally" required to participate in harm reduction? YES.

I have worked in retail nearly my ENTIRE life.....and I would NEVER, EVER sell something dangerous to someone if I felt they were not ready for it, or don't have the proper understanding to use it. I totally understand that not everyone in this world is ethical, but keep in mind - I have NO PROBLEM putting the vape shops on BLAST on here, youtube, twitter, fb, and elsewhere if they don't practice harm reduction. I would hope you guys would do that as well.


A new comer, who has NEVER vaped before, should NEVER leave a vape shop with a mech mod, bats, an rda/sub ohm tank, without proper knowledge.



Again, THAT is one of the main problems I have with "cloud competitions". It promotes the idea that blowing clouds is 'normal'. It isn't. Nowadays, vape shops are directing new comers to the high powered , sub ohm stuff right out of the get go.....and many of these people are CLUELESS. I've seen facebook posts by guys who had someone at a vape shop make them their FIRST coil, 0.1, 0.2 ohms, and asking how they use the device. REALLY?

 

[crxess]

Simple view

Stupid is stupid and no what is being done some stupid Person will do it wrong.

 

[Bad Ninja]

Simple view

Stupid is stupid and no what is being done some stupid Person will do it wrong.

I agree.
Today lots of people want to blame their own stupidity on someone else.

It's never their fault, they never accept responsibility for leaping before they look.

Oh.......I'm going to have to disagree with you ENTIRELY.

It is ABSOLUTELY the shop's job to participate in harm reduction......and part of that includes NOT selling dangerous items to people who seem completely unknowledable.

Are they required by LAW to check out each customer and participate in harm reduction? No. Are they "morally" required to participate in harm reduction? YES.

I have worked in retail nearly my ENTIRE life.....and I would NEVER, EVER sell something dangerous to someone if I felt they were not ready for it, or don't have the proper understanding to use it. I totally understand that not everyone in this world is ethical, but keep in mind - I have NO PROBLEM putting the vape shops on BLAST on here, youtube, twitter, fb, and elsewhere if they don't practice harm reduction. I would hope you guys would do that as well.


A new comer, who has NEVER vaped before, should NEVER leave a vape shop with a mech mod, bats, an RDA/sub ohm tank, without proper knowledge.



Again, THAT is one of the main problems I have with "cloud competitions". It promotes the idea that blowing clouds is 'normal'. It isn't. Nowadays, vape shops are directing new comers to the high powered , sub ohm stuff right out of the get go.....and many of these people are CLUELESS. I've seen facebook posts by guys who had someone at a vape shop make them their FIRST coil, 0.1, 0.2 ohms, and asking how they use the device. REALLY?

So by your logic:
It's a car dealership's responsibility to teach you to drive ?
: facepalm:
Not in any country I've ever lived in.

 

[edyle]

Stop blaming these theoretical shops for user error.

Want the truth?
This is eight grade science. Flashlight mechanics.

We are shorting a battery with kanthal to suck nicotine vapor to get our fix.
Doing this with a metal tube is obviously dangerous to anyone with half a brain.

Mechanicals are advanced user items.
If you don't know the risks, you aren't an advanced user... No matter how "cool" you would look.

Shorting out a common duracell or energizer battery isn't going to blow your teeth out.

18650 batteries need to be sold with some sort of warning label.

When somebody walks into a gun shop, they know they are dealing with guns.
When somebody walks into a firecracker place, they know they are dealing with firecrackers.
When somebody walks into a vape shop, they don't necessarily know that those 'batteries' have some unusual danger compared to other batteries.

 

[Bad Ninja]

When somebody walks into a gun shop, they know they are dealing with guns.
When somebody walks into a firecracker place, they know they are dealing with firecrackers.
When somebody walks into a vape shop, they don't necessarily know that those 'batteries' have some unusual danger compared to other batteries.

Actually the same principals apply.
Just a different battery chemistry.
If you don't understand that a dead short=danger you shouldn't play with mechanicals .

It's not the shops responsibility to teach you that fire burns, firecrackers go "pop" and guns shoot.

To be safe you need to Know these things before you purchase, not spend money and expect the shop to re educate you.

 

[tj99959]

Ultra low ohm builds are not the problem with the rash of failures we've been seeing. So don't confuse the two issues.

 

[ReigntheGamer]

How clueless does one need to be to not know that putting a device with a POWER SUPPLY near ones face could have grave consequences if misused? Sorry but I am against baby proofing vaping, like we have done with just about everything else now days.

 

[Caterpiller]

I'm curious, I know this thread is mainly concerned with Mech Mods, but it seems to me that the latest greatest safety system being pushed in vaping - temperature control - actually requires. You to build near-short coils of 0.05-0.2 ohms.

The DNA40 is rated down to 0.1 in TC mode, I'm not sure about the other TC control chips.

So are we saying VW TC devices are fine to build to 0.1 because thy have short protection, over heat protection (chip not battery), weak battery protection, etc..?

Or are we at some stage going to see a TC device go bang?

 

[ReigntheGamer]

I'm curious, I know this thread is mainly concerned with Mech Mods, but it seems to me that the latest greatest safety system being pushed in vaping - temperature control - actually requires. You to build near-short coils of 0.05-0.2 ohms.

The DNA40 is rated down to 0.1 in TC mode, I'm not sure about the other TC control chips.

So are we saying VW TC devices are fine to build to 0.1 because thy have short protection, over heat protection (chip not battery), weak battery protection, etc..?

Or are we at some stage going to see a TC device go bang?

I had been thinking the same thing for quite awhile now.

 

[tj99959]

How clueless does one need to be to not know that putting a device with a POWER SUPPLY near ones face could have grave consequences if misused? Sorry but I am against baby proofing vaping, like we have done with just about everything else now days.

But by the same token, if a store sells a noob a hybrid top cap mechanical mod & a topper without a proper center pin, (a 3 ohm cartomizer would have the same problem on that type of mod) who is the idiot!?!

 

[ReigntheGamer]

But by the same token, if a store sells a noob a hybrid top cap mechanical mod & a topper without a proper center pin, (a simple cartomizer would have the same problem) who is the idiot!?!

The person who buys something and uses it with absolutely zero knowledge of what they're doing. When I wanted a mech I researched first and once I felt comfortable then I bought one. I do this with anything I get into and if others can't be bothered to do so I have absolutely no sympathy for them when something goes wrong.

 

[Bad Ninja]

But by the same token, if a store sells a noob a hybrid top cap mechanical mod & a topper without a proper center pin, (a simple cartomizer would have the same problem) who is the idiot!?!

The store doesn't pick the noob and force them to buy.

The noob (for whatever reason) comes inTo the place of business and buys the device on their own.

Example: man walks into a hardware store, buys a hammer and (using it incorrectly) bashes himself in the face.

Who's the idiot?

 

[jambi]

Hmmmm, another editorial, eh?

I'm not there. I mean, I guess I just don't care anymore. It's like, just give me my .5 to 1.5 made by me coils, my spool of 26 g Kanthal, my VapeWild freebie baggie of Japanese cotton, my old school Kayfun/Taifun/subtank single coil tanks, my Istick 50 and ancient IPV 3 (that never sees the high side of 30 watts), and my 6$/30ml diketone-laden bottles of juice, and I won't say anything anti .001 build.

Politics of vaping, like the politics of abortion, sweat-shop Nike, it's vs. its, or politics of anything. It's just a ceaseless treadmill...round and round and round and round...

 

[tj99959]

The store doesn't pick the noob and force them to buy.

The noob (for whatever reason) comes inTo the place of business and buys the device on their own.

Example: man walks into a hardware store, buys a hammer and (using it incorrectly) bashes himself in the face.

Who's the idiot?

I have to disagree simply because the store should know that the two products (mod & topper) are not compatible, and should never be sold together.
Why do you think that 20ga shotgun shells are always yellow, and a 12 gauge shell is not allowed to be yellow? About time the e-cig industry catches up!

 

[roxynoodle]

Bad Ninja, I have to disagree with you on what is taught in school. I am the same age as you. I'm gifted in science and took the honors classes. I did not learn Ohm's Law and DC electronics until physics in 12th grade. I also attended a high school where 90% of the graduates go on to college.

Shop class hasn't existed for many years now. More rigorous academic standards have forced schools to remove it from the curriculum. And of course girls were strongly discouraged from taking it back in our day. I did take wood shop in 8th grade instead of home ec, but trust me, that was a battle to earn my right to do so.

Not all students take physics. Its not required to graduate or to go to college.

 

[MattyTny]

I'm curious, I know this thread is mainly concerned with Mech Mods, but it seems to me that the latest greatest safety system being pushed in vaping - temperature control - actually requires. You to build near-short coils of 0.05-0.2 ohms.

The DNA40 is rated down to 0.1 in TC mode, I'm not sure about the other TC control chips.

So are we saying VW TC devices are fine to build to 0.1 because thy have short protection, over heat protection (chip not battery), weak battery protection, etc..?

Or are we at some stage going to see a TC device go bang?

I'm not 100% positive on the information, but the TC devices are supposed to limit and regulate the amount of electrical power to the coil and I think that is enabling us to use resistances that low.

 

[Bad Ninja]

I have to disagree simply because the store should know that the two products (mod & topper) are not compatible, and should never be sold together.

Why are people afraid to take responsibility for their own bad choices?

If every shop was responsible for every idiot who got hurt misusing a product there would be no stores.

The responsibility is on the adult user.

You are responsible for your own stupid decisions.

As an adult you already know this.
That's why you abide by the law.
It applies to other areas of life too.



Back on topic:

The new pre made cheapo sub ohm coils and tanks topping the mechs of noobs are the biggest problem.

Skimp on safety, or ignore science and you will eventually fail.

 

[Brandon David]

My opinion is what other people enjoy is what other people enjoy and who am I to discount that enjoyment?

I started dripping on regulated stuff and would build a single coil around .8-1 ohm and it was perfect at 40ish watts. I then found that I wanted a warmer vape so I built lower. It all snowballed to now where, currently, my favorite builds as far as flavor and vapor density are generally dual 22 or 24g and fall around .16-.17 on a dual parallel unregulated box. With the amount of warmth that comes from vaping that, I need a pretty wide open airflow to ensure I get the temperature I like (which is a fairly warm vape) and in turn, that creates a lot of exhaled vapor.

Earlier this week, I picked up a rebuildable tank I used to enjoy to start carrying at work instead of dripping when walking around. I built it fairly low for a single coil and it just doesn't satisfy at all any more.

So, my opinion is different strokes for different folks.

 

[beckdg]

Shorting out a common duracell or energizer battery isn't going to blow your teeth out.

That's a bold, incomplete and uneducated statement.

Alkaline, nicad, Nimh and lithium hybrid AA, AAA, C, SUB C, D and 9V batteries all have the potential for explosion.

The same as any energy storage device encased in metal.

It's all about the care needed vs. The abuse given to each chemistry.

Tapatyped

 

[tj99959]

Why are people afraid to take responsibility for their own bad choices?

Because they had no way of knowing that it was a "bad choice".

No different than buying a defective baby crib or car seat. You won't know that it was a "bad choice" until it's to late, unless someone tells you that it's a bad choice.

This isn't about the pros & cons of sub ohm vaping, it's about mods & toppers that are not compatible with each other. ( the cause of every one of these incidences lately)