The most pivotal person in vapings future ?

[Vandal]

As they say in the article, I am hopeful but not expectant, especially since Totally Wicked's similar arguments in EU were rejected. So much riding on the decision of one person...

 

[Eskie]

Agreed, however, if "we" win, that will make the FDA 0-3 in Federal Court (correct me if I'm wrong), which might give them pause as to whether they should appeal, although they probably will anyway.

Keep in mind the FDA has essentially unlimited resources for litigation. They can rely on federal lawyers to do this stuff, whereas the vape companies and lobbyists have to pay a ton of money to keep top tier law firms working on this. If deep pockets win lawsuits (which is usually the way it works) the FDA has the deepest, our tax money.

 

[Mazinny]

I understand your reasoning. however, I can't see much of a public backlash, as I've yet to meet one non-vaper who knew anything about these regulations. However, I'm quite sure the professional anti-smoking brigade will kick and scream. Age restriction can still be applied at the state level, and I would expect that to occur regardless of any stay or ultimate outcome from the litigation. Even the plaintiffs in this suit (essentially us) already ceded that age restrictions and child resistant packaging should be required, and as you said, is already being voluntarily applied by retailers.

Age restriction is already being applied at state level in all but three or four states.

I agree about the general public' apathy toward vaping. I often hear that the general public' opinion has been poisoned by government and ANTZ propaganda, but i've yet to encounter any non-vaper who has a strong opinion about vaping one way or another. Even those who are prone to believe it's probably not good, don't hold strong convictions about the topic. I've met some who don't like vapor blown too close in their direction, but that's just about as deep as their concern goes. I have heard some flippant comments about the size of the large vaporizers and how it looks douchey etc..., but very little about the health aspects.

I have tried to talk about the science and politics of vaping with many whose opinion i respect, but all i get is a cursory nod of acknowledgement. My own brother is a physician, but i've yet to have a discussion longer than 30 seconds with him about vaping. He is happy that i vape instead of smoking, would rather i don't do that either, but generally agnostic about vaping. That's really the extent of his interest in the topic. He is an eye surgeon though, so i cut him some slack !

 

[Jonner]

Keep in mind the FDA has essentially unlimited resources for litigation. They can rely on federal lawyers to do this stuff, whereas the vape companies and lobbyists have to pay a ton of money to keep top tier law firms working on this. If deep pockets win lawsuits (which is usually the way it works) the FDA has the deepest, our tax money.

I'm a lawyer, and I'm picking up what you're laying down, yet I remain hopeful.

 

[Eskie]

I'm a lawyer, and I'm picking up what you're laying down, yet I remain hopeful.

Then you know all too well how it works in complex litigation. I think the litigation, particularly if running against the overreach by the FDA, will be useful in supporting legislation to sort out what the FDA can and cannot do with vaping. Trying to box in an agency with litigation only is like herding cats. Better to amend their charter and give them clearly delineated limits rather than the broad, ill defined power they feel can be applied wherever they want.

 

[Jonner]

Eskie, exactly, even a loss might be considered a "win."