Kanthal vs Nichrome

[fourtytwo]

I'm sure it's been asked but what are the main advantages of Kanthal wire over nichrome?
I can see that Kanthal seems to have a slightly higher operating temperature then nichrome but it seems to be very much harder to find then ordinary nichrome.
Yeah, I know there are a number of vendors on eBay but I was just wondering...

 

[DonG]

aside from the higher temperature tolerance (which increases durability, a good thing); some have said it gives better flavor, sometimes noticing a metallic taste from nichrome but not from the equivelent size of kanthal.

 

[fourtytwo]

Interesting.
I have seen in some documents that the tensile strength of nichrome at 900c is more then triple that of Kanthal. This is not an important factor as there is no real tension on the wire in use.
Any opinion on which Kanthal wire is best? I have found four. Kanthal seems to come in APM, A-1, AF and D.

 

[WillyB]

aside from the higher temperature tolerance (which increases durability, a good thing); some have said it gives better flavor, sometimes noticing a metallic taste from nichrome but not from the equivelent size of kanthal.

Interesting, I find that it's the Kanthal that has the iron taste, as far as "higher temperature tolerance", NiCrA has a melting point of 1400°C, or 2550°F. It can safely handle a max working temp of about 1800°F. I'd venture to say that's more than high enough. Most actual coil temperature measurements I've seen on these forums of a 510 atty coil have been around 200°F. But let's call it 300°F or 17% of it's max rating. And at 300°F the resistance rises by a measly ~1.6%.

 

[fourtytwo]

That is pretty much what I am thinking. Neither the temp tolerance nor tensile strength are very important as for this application, there is very little chance of getting anwhere near the upper limits.
Here is a bit of interesting reading.
http://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=j...sg=AFQjCNGqsVGFv-KwSy6TPa9e2eIchF3QwQ&cad=rja

 

[rondasherrill]

I am usng 32ga Nichrome wire. I noticed something that I thought was worth asking about... I made a 2.8ohm coil, checked on my Provari, but after about 2-3 hours of use, it is down to 2.3 ohms. It seems to have settled there, and I have been using it for 2 days now. I use a SS Mesh wick if that matters.

Is it normal for the coil to have such a big drop right off the bat like that?

 

[BJ43]

The laws of thermodynamics, metallurgy, expansion, and creep are pretty complicated, If we only heated these coils to 300 F, they would last a very long time. The reason for coils breaking is because of overheating. Just dry burn too long and they will all pop, and when they get bright orange they are way over 300F. You all have much better taste buds than I have after more than 50 yrs of 3 packs a day. 3yrs of no analogs hasn't given me the ability to taste the difference between nichrome and kanthal. lol

 

[LucentShadow]

I don't see any clear advantage between the two for our purposes, based upon what I have read. I like nichrome 34-36 gauge. I see that many who use kanthal use 32 gauge.

Kanthal is supposed to be mainly iron, with a fair amount of chromium and a small amount of Aluminum. Nichrome is largely nickel with similar or less amount of chromium than kanthal, and sometimes some iron. Some people can have allergies to metals, so that's a consideration.

I am usng 32ga Nichrome wire. I noticed something that I thought was worth asking about... I made a 2.8ohm coil, checked on my Provari, but after about 2-3 hours of use, it is down to 2.3 ohms. It seems to have settled there, and I have been using it for 2 days now. I use a SS Mesh wick if that matters.

Is it normal for the coil to have such a big drop right off the bat like that?

Not in my experience. I'd guess that a couple of the coils have shorted together, either by contact or through the wick.

 

[rondasherrill]

Not in my experience. I'd guess that a couple of the coils have shorted together, either by contact or through the wick.

Interestingly, after performing a dry burn, the resistance went right back up to normal.

 

[WillyB]

Interestingly, after performing a dry burn, the resistance went right back up to normal.

I've often had Joye510s drop from ~2.2 to 1.8Ω with use, I assumed it was the crud build up cuz even though they were then pulling more current/watts performance suffered. Dry burns would sometimes help.

 

[Tonytiger1]

Were do get the wire and mesh. I just ordered a did. Do they see the stuff at local stores Thanks in advance

 

[Cyrus Vap]

After spending months on nichrome, I suddenly became very aware of the taste, and I didn't like it

Oddly enough, the 34 gauge nichrome I have has far less of a taste. Starts out bad, then improves with time. The 32 gauge starts off considerably worse, and it never seems to go away.

Got some 32 gauge kanthal recently. The first hit is god awful, the worst of the lot. And it rapidly (as in 2-3 hits) vanishes and never returns

the bad news is, its probably entirely subjective and thus there's only one way to find out which will work for you

 

[WillyB]

Which nichrome? The 60 or the 80?

 

[Cyrus Vap]

It's nichrome 80 sir.

 

[l3oertjie]

I've often had Joye510s drop from ~2.2 to 1.8Ω with use, I assumed it was the crud build up cuz even though they were then pulling more current/watts performance suffered. Dry burns would sometimes help.

Interesting observation WillyB.

If the resitance drops the performance in power should increase surely? P=IV & V=IR thus I=V/R so less R means more I when V stays constant (well almost)... Can we then attribute the performace drop to the "crud" buildup?

 

[Cyrus Vap]

Hmm

Insert delirious speculation generated by procrastinating studying psychiatry:

so maybe your R is dropping as the crust offers an alternate path for conduction, I increases, W increases, but that 'conducting crust' is poor at producing vapor vs. the coil so you get a performance drop?

 

[WillyB]

Interesting observation WillyB.

If the resitance drops the performance in power should increase surely? P=IV & V=IR thus I=V/R so less R means more I when V stays constant (well almost)... Can we then attribute the performace drop to the "crud" buildup?

Sounds about right. The problem with always referring to watts is we don't vape watts. These aren't some pristine, little open air space heaters that would in fact strictly obey Ohm's Law. As the crud builds up it also insulates and the real heat/temperature is now less which is affecting how the liquid is being vaporized.

 

[Matt815]

If kanthal has aluminium in it, thats not good!!! aluminium is a neurotoxin.

 

[rondasherrill]

If kanthal has aluminium in it, thats not good!!! aluminium is a neurotoxin.

It would require almost 1200 degrees to break down the aluminum and inhale it. Atomizers don't even reach half of that.

 

[Jshill520]

I've noticed with nichrome your coils will warp and shrink or stretch on the first burn. If you heat it with a flame prior to building your coil it solves the problem though.