I looked up reviews of it after the fact and most were pretty good but this is just kinda flavorless (guessing because of flavor degredation, don’t think it’s anything to do with my setup).
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If I'm not mistaken, and it could be federal or state laws, drinking alcohol products can not be returned
- And with all the crazy regulations being placed on tobacco and especially vaping, it is possible that they legally could not take it back - Of course if they wanted to be nice they could have just exchanged it
- Maybe you should shop somewhere else BUT if you know what's going on there soon may be nowhere, and that includes online, to shop for any commercially made vape juices or hardware !
As far as going bad goes - Several people here, and elsewhere, have recommended storing all your commercially made juices in the refrigerator, but not the freezer as apparently freezing temperatures can damage some flavors.
People who do their own mixing {DIY} do recommend storing nicotine itself in the freezer.
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My guess is that since it wasn't a dedicated vape shop they couldn't exchange it, because all of their juice was outdated. They should have given you a refund, but they really weren't interested enough in your return business. Stick with vape shops or online vape shops.
Yeah, due to possible health risks, vape stores won't take back any juices sold. They are not being an a double s. Standard across the board policy. You buy it, it's yours.
For a normal transaction, involving unexpired juice, that makes sense. But if the juice is expired, they shouldn't put it out for resale anyway. It is their right as a business not to refund or exchange after such a sale, but it is poor business practice and doesn't lend to repeat customer sales. My guess is they aren't really interested in the vapers' business, as they are a head shop.
If I bought milk or meat or whatever at the grocery store and found that it was already past the sell-by date, I'd blame the store. Pulling out of date merchandise is part of their job. Why would vape juice be any different? They shouldn't be selling it after the expiration date without giving you any warning about it.
Yeah what really sucks is that after the employee called the boss (owner?), they basically acknowledged that it will degrade over time but still offer no sort of compensation after charging full price. If it was a legal thing, its not like they had to actually accept it back to exchange it or reimburse me.
True story - my mother told me about how she was often told to re-date meat products that were close to their 'use-by' dates (in a well-known UK supermarket in the 70's)....
But i digress... The trouble with e-liquid is that some flavours are awful from the get-go, so it's hard to say if a two year old bottle is supposed to taste like it does. I have found that most tobacco flavours improve over time and most fruit flavours don't.
The shop that sold you the liquid may well be aware that the use-by dates on vape juice are completely arbitary and that may have influenced the decision not to refund. In my opinion their decision was wrong. I would exact vengence - it's hardly your fault that their stock rotation and management skills are rubbish...
But i digress... The trouble with e-liquid is that some flavours are awful from the get-go, so it's hard to say if a two year old bottle is supposed to taste like it does. I have found that most tobacco flavours improve over time and most fruit flavours don't.
The shop that sold you the liquid may well be aware that the use-by dates on vape juice are completely arbitary and that may have influenced the decision not to refund. In my opinion their decision was wrong. I would exact vengence - it's hardly your fault that their stock rotation and management skills are rubbish...
My opinion only, without any real science to back it up: In the low concentrations present in finished e-liquid, it's more a question of it reactions with the flavorings over time than outright degrading. I base this opinion on the following experience:
I can make a bottle of 12mg unflavored liquid and leave it at room temperature for months without any perceptible change in color or or much perceptible change in taste. This is not true of 100 mg "base", which does degrade noticeably over the same time span.
I can make a bottle of flavored, zero-nic juice and (assuming the flavorings were colorless to begin with) it will remain water-clear more-or-less forever.
However, if I make that same flavored liquid with 12mg of nicotine, it will start to visibly darken within a week or two.
Thus my conclusion is that nicotine and flavorings react.
Coincidently i made two bottles of 12mg 50/50 liquid for a friend literally yesterday. One was strawberry and pineapple flavour and one was blackcurrant and raspberry flavour. All flavourings are/were colourless.
The strawberry blend has already turned red/orange and the blackcurrant remains clear. That is one fast reaction...
The strawberry blend has already turned red/orange and the blackcurrant remains clear. That is one fast reaction...
There is a 'dark side' to this information {pun intended}
When the lawsuits against the FDA denial orders, especially on flavored vape juice, that are already happening get to the courts - the FDA which already claims flavors are more dangerous because of youth appeal, may try to show that the flavors, because of chemical reactions with nicotine, are more dangerous ?
They could make any claim they wished. Without evidence though it's just propaganda. I could claim that the rapid change in colour signifies a rise in antioxidants therefore making the liquid beneficial to health and potentially reducing the aging process... That's as factual as a lot of anti-vaping arguements (i.e. fact-free but vaguely science-y sounding) 
True - But knowing how they've been treating the whole vape industry - You know they will start to ask any manufacturer to prove that every flavor is safe to add. Actually that type info might be useful - Do some flavors actually produce negative chemical reactions that may be harmful? I like natural and some flavorsThey could make any claim they wished. Without evidence though it's just propaganda. I could claim that the rapid change in colour signifies a rise in antioxidants therefore making the liquid beneficial to health and potentially reducing the aging process... That's as factual as a lot of anti-vaping arguements (i.e. fact-free but vaguely science-y sounding)
- But if a particular flavor has a health downside I'd like to know about it.
I wonder if the FDA need a breakdown from fruit cocktail manufacturers when they decide to mix apple with mango or banana with apricot. I'm sure there are a lot of different reactions happening..... What about 50% pear, 10% cherry, 10% apple, 20% tangerine, 5% mango and 5% cane syrup ? What happens when pears are in short supply so the percentages change ? You could go on for ever...
If the individual ingredients are deemed to be safe then, in the absence of contradictory data, it must be assumed that the whole is safe. Otherwise we simply couldn't combine anything. Ever.
If the individual ingredients are deemed to be safe then, in the absence of contradictory data, it must be assumed that the whole is safe. Otherwise we simply couldn't combine anything. Ever.
I'm not telling you to try anything more with the unethical seller who did this to you, but in the future, always pay by credit card. It's funny how a seller will decide to do the right thing if you put the bad product back on their counter and say "my credit card issuer will back me up, even if you won't do the right thing". You have a limited time frame in which to dispute a credit card charge, and you have to demonstrate that you tried to settle the matter directly with the seller, keeping track of when you acted, whom you spoke to, and what their response was. Take a pic of the receipt and of the bottle expiration date for your dispute record.
I'm not saying to use the dispute process frivolously, or to use it without first trying to get the right action from the seller. It is the nuclear option, and if used without doing your own diligence first, can come back to downgrade your own credibility.
A seller can only have so many charge-backs before they lose the privilege of taking credit card payments.
The store may need your money at the moment, but obviously they think they can afford not to have your business after this one transaction. It would barely cost them anything to replace your expired bottle with a fresh one and make you a satisfied customer.
Shady SOB's.
I'm not saying to use the dispute process frivolously, or to use it without first trying to get the right action from the seller. It is the nuclear option, and if used without doing your own diligence first, can come back to downgrade your own credibility.
A seller can only have so many charge-backs before they lose the privilege of taking credit card payments.
The store may need your money at the moment, but obviously they think they can afford not to have your business after this one transaction. It would barely cost them anything to replace your expired bottle with a fresh one and make you a satisfied customer.
Shady SOB's.
Last year I ordered online from a seller I'd used for years. I received five bottles of the wrong flavor, wrong nic level, wrong pg/vg ratio on all five bottles. It was obviously someone else's order. I think the seller was in financial trouble, and I believe they have gone under. Their website doesn't work any longer. Anyway, I first emailed them by replying on the order, which was a "support@xxxx.com" email address. No reply. So then I sent a message by logging into my account, clicking "orders", clicking the specific order, and there was a messaging engine there. Tried that, no reply. So I tried phoning them twice, on two separate days during normal business hours. No answer.
So I took the nuclear option and successfully charged back through my credit card issuer. Defective or wrong is defective or wrong. Even the alcohol seller will have to somehow make amends if they deliver the wrong bottle to you, or deliver something leaking, or with broken glass in it.
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