18350 vs 18650? What's the 18350 Equivalent of a Sony VTC5?

[ModBox]

Sony VTC5s are my current reference point for batteries in mechanical mods. I bought them as the VTC4s were well thought of for performance power and longevity. I think they're great - provide enough power and last all day.

However, I want a smaller mod to take out with me for use in public so am wonder what the equivalent of a VTC5 is in 18350? I see some are rated at 700/800mah compared to the VTC5 at 2600mah - Is this the best you can get currently? Does this mean I should expect then to last 1/3 as long so I would maybe need 3 per day?

1) How long do 18350s last vs. 18650 (Sony VTC5) roughly?

2) How long do 18490s last vs 18650 roughly?

3) Do smaller batteries they perform as well (hit as hard) or the lower Amp limit of 18350s affect this?

 

[anumber1]

There is no equivalent battery to the Sony 18650 in a 18350 size.

The 18350 is a smaller battery with less capacity in every regard compared to the Sony US18650VTC5.

If you want large capacity and high amp limits, the bigger batteries are what you need.

 

[Ryedan]

However, I want a smaller mod to take out with me for use in public so am wonder what the equivalent of a VTC5 is in 18350? I see some are rated at 700/800mah compared to the VTC5 at 2600mah - Is this the best you can get currently?

Yes for IMR batteries which are what you want for safety and high amp draw. If you see more than 800 mAh specified on a 18350 it's either ICR (typically will also be protected) or the number is exaggerated.

1) How long do 18350s last vs. 18650 (Sony VTC5) roughly?

Theoretically a 700 mAh battery will last 27% as long as a 2600 mAh battery if used at the same amp draw. 700/2600*100. If you're not going to use them at the same current draw, doubling the current drains a battery twice as fast.

2) How long do 18490s last vs 18650 roughly?

I think I answered that above, unless you mean how many charge cycles. They should last the same, around 300 cycles. You're probably going to use them at closer to their max current draw though and that will likely shorten their life.

3) Do smaller batteries they perform as well (hit as hard) or the lower Amp limit of 18350s affect this?

I don't have enough experience with smaller batteries to know from experience, but I think internal resistance is reasonably low on all IMR batteries. That means they will hit hard too at the same voltage. You can obviously not run a 18350 with coils as low in resistance as with 18650s as the safe amp limit is lower.

The amp limit does not affect battery output. When you draw more than it's rated for it starts to heat up. Get a battery hot enough and it will vent which can be dangerous.

 

[ModBox]

Thanks that helps alot. So what would be a generally safe coil range for 18350s? I guess it's the AW 700mah or the Efest 800mah then is it? I'd probably need 2-3 for a full day then and 1-2 for a night out. Cool how sony increased the vtc4 - vtc5 by something like 500mah. I guess these kind of increases aren't coming to 18350s anytime soon.

 

[Froth]

The highest amp rating I know of in an IMR 18350 is the Efest 700mah Purple 18350 which is rated at 10.5A, I have a pair of them and have run them as low as .45 dual coil and had no issues whatsoever other than a fairly short battery life, 18350's charge fast though.

 

[PaulBHC]

Higher ohms the 18350s will give you more time than lower ohms. Out and about with over 2 ohm clearos I get a few hours from one.

 

[Baditude]

How long any battery will last on a charge depends upon how hard you will use it. Meaning, what juice attachment will you be using. A standard resistance clearo/carto will be less draw on the battery than a 0.6 ohm RBA. You might get 7 - 8 hours use on a 700mah 18350 IMR battery when using a 2.0 ohm carto, but only 2 hours with a 0.6 ohm RBA.

When doing sub-ohm coils especially, you have to know the amp limit of the battery. List of Battery Amp Limits

Use the Ohm's Law Calculator to determine if the coil resistance of your RBA will pull more amps than the battery has to provide. Going over the amp limit of the battery can have catastrophic results. Ohm's Law for Dummies

1.0 ohm = 4.2 amp draw
0.9 ohm = 4.6 amp draw
0.8 ohm = 5.2 amp draw
0.7 ohms = 6 amp draw
0.6 ohms = 7 amp draw
0.5 ohms = 8.4 amp draw
0.4 ohms = 10.5 amp draw
0.3 ohms = 14.0 amp draw
0.2 ohms = 21.0 amp draw
0.1 ohms = 42.0 amp draw

• AW 18350 IMR battery has a 6 amp limit. Therefore I'd not use it with a coil less than 0.9 ohm to allow some safe headroom.
• Purple Efest 18350 IMR allegedly has a 10.5 amp limit. Therefore I'd not use it with a coil less than 0.6 amps, again allowing for some safe headroom for added safety.

 

[ModBox]

Thanks guys

@froththats another thing I was wondering - if they charge fast which you say they do so that's good.

At the moment I tend to use about a 0.9 - 1.3 ohm coil - I haven't experimented with lower but I actually find 4.2v at 1.3 a bit much until the battery settles down to about 3.95 or 3.8v (with kayfuns/taifuns).

I'll go for either the purple efests or the AW then - are they both as good as each other in terms of battery life and safety? I have seen efest in 800mah - any good?

 

[Baditude]

I'm not personally a fan of Efest batteries. I've had disappointing experience with them personally (poor battery life compared to comparable AW batteries) and my research has shown that the company often exaggerates their battery specifications.

Andrew Wan (AW) is a battery distributor in Hong Kong who purchases huge quantities of batteries from the large battery manufacturers in Japan. He realizes that not all batteries are created equal from the factories, so he and his staff test each battery individually for quality. The best get sorted to be sold as AW brand batteries. You pay a little more for a known quality battery.

Except for a couple of times when I experimented with Efest batteries, the only batteries I have used have been AW IMR batteries. They have never let me down. I have a couple of AW 18650 IMR batteries which are 2 years old and are just now beginning to show their age.

(* I lied. This week I purchased 3 Sony 30 amp batteries for my first sub-ohm coils.)

 

[Ryedan]

(* I lied. This week I purchased 3 Sony 30 amp batteries for my first sub-ohm coils.)

Sacrilege ...

So what are you planing to build for these puppies? I still remember my first sub ohm build. It was on my AGA-T and I think I got it working about two weeks later .

Hope it works out well for you!

ETA: Your in box is full.

 

[Baditude]

Sacrilege ...

So what are you planing to build for these puppies? I still remember my first sub ohm build. It was on my AGA-T and I think I got it working about two weeks later .

Hope it works out well for you!

ETA: Your in box is full.

Dual micro-coils at 0.5 ohm on a Patriot RDA for my Silver Bullet. I had one of the experts at my vape shop build it for me so that I can copy it myself.

 

[WattWick]

A higher capacity/bigger battery is capable of higher discharge currents. Take the exact same materials found in a 18650 VTC5 and make a smaller, 18350 battery. It would have a much lower potential current output.

The VTC5 is a 2.600 mAh battery with 30 amps current output. (I may be mistaken, but this is just to illustrate anyway).
This means it has a "C" rating of roughly 11.5. A 700 mAh battery with a C rating of 11.5 can (safely) output roughly 8 amps.