"The Dual User" on VP Live

[kevbow]

This Sunday at 9:00pm est I will be doing a show on the dual user. If there are any dual users out there that would like to share your experience during the show please feel free to call in. The number is 347-308-8329.

VapersPlace | VP-Live

 

[BardicDruid]

What do you mean by dual user???? Do you mean someone who still smokes cigarettes and vapes, someone who vapes and uses snus, or someone that smokes, vapes and uses snus, dip or chew????

 

[tybin]

or someone who uses more than one pv at once?

 

[Vocalek]

I vape and chew--nicotine gum.

 

[kevbow]

What do you mean by dual user???? Do you mean someone who still smokes cigarettes and vapes, someone who vapes and uses snus, or someone that smokes, vapes and uses snus, dip or chew????

All of the above. Someone who vapes and still smoke, snus, wta's, gum, patches etc. etc etc.

 

[rothenbj]

When you decide to do the multi-user show I'll call in. Let's see, I'm now a primary snus user, fairly regular (a few puffs a day) WTA user, an infrequent nicquid user at this point and just recently a snuff user on occasion. With all those wonderful possibilities, there really is no time for cigarettes anymore.

 

[Vocalek]

Kevin: Make sure you ask folks two questions:

1. Do you still smoke as many cigarettes as you did when all you did was smoke?
2. What effect has the "dual use" had on your health?

From reports I have seen, "dual use" does not increase "exposure to toxins" or "increase addiction" as the ANTZ claim. Most people smoke less, or eventuially stop smoking altogether.

I think if we could gather evidence that dual users experience improvements in their health (measured from when they only smoked), this might shut down this myth eventually. I realize that this isn't a formal study, but it's a start. I might be able to get a researcher interested in following up on this topic.

 

[Stubby]

From all the evidence I've seen tobacco/nicotine users tend to reach a certain level of use and stay there indefinitely. A pack a day smoker tends to stay that way for decades. I tried numerous times in the past to cut down on smoking thinking I could eventually quit. It never worked. Any little stress that came up and I was right back where I started. I didn't need much of an excuse. On the other side lots of folks will smoke more when under stress, but when things get back to normal will go back to the previous level. It doesn't increase the tolerance. I have never seen one bit of evidence contrary. I hear a lot of talk of people afraid they will increase there tolerance but have seen no real evidence that it happens.

Something to keep in mind is that some people may be increasing their nicotine uptake with e-cigs as a way of compensating for the lack of the other alkaloids missing in e-liquid. The straight nicotine in e-liquid does not give the same experience as a whole tobacco alkaloid (WTA). A certain percentage of people are more sensitive to that then others. Of course snus has the WTA.

It would be interesting to see some long term studies instead of just antidotal evidence. The dual use scare does seem to be a red herring.

 

[rothenbj]

My personal experience was that my use of cigarettes always seemed to increase after a quit attempt. I don't think it had much to do with a need for nic or anything else, just disgust for another failed attempt. I've been at the 4-5 portion of snus level as I move toward 2 years with very infrequent 6 portion days.

I was vaping infrequently until WTA came along and I'd say I vape daily now but more for how it vapes rather than any need. If I do a ml every three days on average I'd be surprised. My recent snuff addition may just be experimentation, but I like a little whiff for the various scents.

I can't believe my intake of nic today is anywhere near what is was smoking 2-3 packs a day let along the volume of tobacco products. I smoked the longs and I think I read that they have a little less than a gram of tobacco with the rest being filter/paper and reconstituted tobacco (actually doubling the weight of a smoke). I was consuming somewhere in the area of 25gms of tobacco a day plus that other "stuff" that was part of a cigarette, except the filter (which of course I littered the landscape with as a disgusting smoker, right ANTZ?) Anyway, today I use less than 6 gms of everything tobacco related and part of that is water and PG/VG AND NONE OF IT IS SMOKED.

 

[kevbow]

Kevin: Make sure you ask folks two questions:

1. Do you still smoke as many cigarettes as you did when all you did was smoke?
2. What effect has the "dual use" had on your health?

From reports I have seen, "dual use" does not increase "exposure to toxins" or "increase addiction" as the ANTZ claim. Most people smoke less, or eventuially stop smoking altogether.

I think if we could gather evidence that dual users experience improvements in their health (measured from when they only smoked), this might shut down this myth eventually. I realize that this isn't a formal study, but it's a start. I might be able to get a researcher interested in following up on this topic.

I will ask Elaine

 

[RippleInStillWater]

Man, I thought it was about DCAs or DCCs!!!

My best friend uses a REO and a half pack a day now but I don't understand how he can do it, I can't even stand the taste of tobacco anymore........

 

[dee5]

I wish I had seen this earlier, would have like to give my 2 cents. I cut my cigarette smoking from a 1 1/2 PAD habit down to about 3-6 a day by vaping. I've stayed at this level for 2 1/2 years. Cigarettes still p#ss me off sometimes but I still smoke them, just not nearly as many. My health has still improved with the addition of vaping (which I do constantly!).

 

[Stubby]

My personal experience was that my use of cigarettes always seemed to increase after a quit attempt. I don't think it had much to do with a need for nic or anything else, just disgust for another failed attempt. I've been at the 4-5 portion of snus level as I move toward 2 years with very infrequent 6 portion days.

I was vaping infrequently until WTA came along and I'd say I vape daily now but more for how it vapes rather than any need. If I do a ml every three days on average I'd be surprised. My recent snuff addition may just be experimentation, but I like a little whiff for the various scents.

I can't believe my intake of nic today is anywhere near what is was smoking 2-3 packs a day let along the volume of tobacco products. I smoked the longs and I think I read that they have a little less than a gram of tobacco with the rest being filter/paper and reconstituted tobacco (actually doubling the weight of a smoke). I was consuming somewhere in the area of 25gms of tobacco a day plus that other "stuff" that was part of a cigarette, except the filter (which of course I littered the landscape with as a disgusting smoker, right ANTZ?) Anyway, today I use less than 6 gms of everything tobacco related and part of that is water and PG/VG AND NONE OF IT IS SMOKED.

My understanding is that smokeless tobacco comes on slower by stays around longer so you don't need as much to keep you nicotine level up. Cigarettes have a very high spike and then a relatively quick drop. I do about 6 standard portions a day of snus and a Stonewall or two and its plenty to keep me satisfied. Overall it's much less then the pack a day I was smoking.

I haven't tried any WTA as of yet but the idea is intriguing. I haven't used an e-cig for so long I don't know how I would react. At this point I'm just not willing to invest the money in the equipment I would want as what I have now is junk. Perhaps when it becomes more common and the price of the WTA liquid comes down it may be worthwhile to give it a try. Just to have another alternative to fall back on would be nice.

I wish I had seen this earlier, would have like to give my 2 cents. I cut my cigarette smoking from a 1 1/2 PAD habit down to about 3-6 a day by vaping. I've stayed at this level for 2 1/2 years. Cigarettes still p#ss me off sometimes but I still smoke them, just not nearly as many. My health has still improved with the addition of vaping (which I do constantly!).

You may be a candidate for some WTA. It can work wonders for folks who struggle to quit smoking and/or get caught up in chain vaping. A bunch of us had the same problem until we started supplementing things with a bit of snus or some WTA liquid (though I haven't' tried the latter).

 

[kevbow]

For those who missed he show the replay is now up VapersPlace | VP-Live

 

[RippleInStillWater]

It was really enjoyable and informative as always, Kev! It was nice for BG to give away some Snus......

 

[kevbow]

It was really enjoyable and informative as always, Kev! It was nice for BG to give away some Snus......

Thanks ripple. A big thanks to bikergirl for donating the snus for the giveaway. Nice to see ripple win a prize too

 

[rothenbj]

Stubby,'

The WTA for me is like smoking a cigar (not really but for comparative purposes). E Cigs got pretty boring and mine sat pretty much after finding snus. Occasionally, in a bar setting I'd puff it a bit but I already realized that nic wasn't my big draw on smoking. However WTA makes me think about vaping a bit more. Bar scene- most times, but still part of a convo opener. On the internet at night, a few puffs. I just like the feel and talking about it, I took a puff. I was dripping, but got both a screwdriver tank and a tornado tank which both work for me. Generally, I use the SD and I might fill the 1ml tak every three days.