Question about safety

[wizdumb1]

I'm sure uneducated posts like this are everywhere...lol
I usually use the same wire material with the same wrap for years. Basically I was shown a safe dual coil setup that has worked for years. I went to get more wire and it's sold out so I settled with ss316l 26ga * 2 + 30ga. I did 5 wraps around a 1/8 bit and both coils in my Voopo Drag 2 come up at 0.12 My usual 85w seems to take longer heating it up but at the same time it gets hot after vaping for a little. That's not the real problem though, Now I'm questioning safety is all.

I rotate between 2 HG2 and 2 Samsung 30Q. Am I safe at these wattages? I've played with calculators and have been reading but there really are no solid answers. I guess I just don't get it when you get into coils styles and multiple wires.

 

[SupplyDaddy]

If you used thinner wire before, you're going to need more power to heat up the thicker coils.
But you didn't say what you normally used..

If your regulated mod can handle the ohms at the wattage you want/need, then you should be fine. They have safeties in place (or at least the ones from the last few years do..).

 

[Mordacai]

Hello @wizdumb1, I just checked for you with an ohms law calculator and with those values you're pulling over 26 Amps.

The values you need for calculations are.

Watts = Power

Resistance = Ohms

Here's a link to an online ohms law calculator.

Ohms Law Calculator

And here's a link to @Mooch's blog, he's our resident battery guru who helps us reduce our risks.

Mooch's blog | E-Cigarette Forum

But if you were considering some more 18650 cells to add in the rotation the Molicel P28A cells may be of interest.

And your atomiser is slow to heat and slow to cool, because of the mass of your coil build.

You would possibly be able to reduce the mass by increasing the surface area of the coil in contact with the wicking, by using a flat multi core Clapton type coil made with thinner wire. But it's trial and error to find out what works best for you.

 

[AngeNZ]

I'm sure uneducated posts like this are everywhere...lol
I usually use the same wire material with the same wrap for years. Basically I was shown a safe dual coil setup that has worked for years. I went to get more wire and it's sold out so I settled with ss316l 26ga * 2 + 30ga. I did 5 wraps around a 1/8 bit and both coils in my Voopo Drag 2 come up at 0.12 My usual 85w seems to take longer heating it up but at the same time it gets hot after vaping for a little. That's not the real problem though, Now I'm questioning safety is all.

I rotate between 2 HG2 and 2 Samsung 30Q. Am I safe at these wattages? I've played with calculators and have been reading but there really are no solid answers. I guess I just don't get it when you get into coils styles and multiple wires.

Your using a regulated mod, so as you've figured it's just the wattage that determines how many amps you pull.

The Samsung 30q is 15a (20a if under 75c) and the LG HG2's are 20A
from Mooch's Recommended Batteries:

as you use 2 batteries even the 30q @ 15amp is OK to 90 watts. The LG HG2 can go up to 120watts.

If you ever want to calculate it yourself, read:
Calculating battery current draw for a regulated mod | E-Cigarette Forum

 

[AngeNZ]

Hello @wizdumb1, I just checked for you with an ohms law calculator and with those values you're pulling over 26 Amps.

The values you need for calculations are.

Watts = Power

Resistance = Ohms

Here's a link to an online ohms law calculator.

Ohms Law Calculator

And here's a link to @Mooch's blog, he's our resident battery guru who helps us reduce our risks.

Mooch's blog | E-Cigarette Forum

But if you were considering some more 18650 cells to add in the rotation the Molicel P28A cells may be of interest.

And your atomiser is slow to heat and slow to cool, because of the mass of your coil build.

You would possibly be able to reduce the mass by increasing the surface area of the coil in contact with the wicking, by using a flat multi core Clapton type coil made with thinner wire. But it's trial and error to find out what works best for you.

Since he/she's using a regulated mod - the resistance doesn't matter. Amps drawn are down to whatever wattage you set the mod to.
You use this calculation:
Max Amps Per Battery = (Max Wattage Per Battery / Minimum Voltage Per Battery) / 0.9

from:
Calculating battery current draw for a regulated mod | E-Cigarette Forum

 

[Mordacai]

And I'm trying to remember here.

If I remember rightly, parallel batteries double the Amps and series doubles the Volts.

Hopefully I've remembered correctly, as I'm the type of individual who goes out and gets the highest CDR (Constant Discharge Rate, amount of Amps that can be drawn constantly) batteries just to make sure that I'm as safe as possible.

 

[Mordacai]

@AngeNZ, Amps will always be drawn from the cell or cells used.

And don't forget that this is physics, and physics has immutable laws.

 

[AngeNZ]

@AngeNZ, Amps will always be drawn from the cell or cells used.

of course they are but you don't need to use resistance when calculating the battery current draw for a regulated mod:
Calculating battery current draw for a regulated mod | E-Cigarette Forum

 

[Mordacai]

On a side note, think of the wonderful punishment for underage vapers.

Make them learn all the dark arts of vaping, physics, chemistry and such. I think that most would quit pretty quickly.

 

[AngeNZ]

On a side note, think of the wonderful punishment for underage vapers.

Make them learn all the dark arts of vaping, physics, chemistry and such. I think that most would quit pretty quickly.

Perfect plan no 50mg Juul, for underages until you can successfully build and wick a dual coil RDA and work out ohm's law in your head

 

[somdcomputerguy]

While I give Mooch a mighty bow to everything he does for vapers, I cheat sometimes and use this Regulated Mod Amp Draw Calculator. This may be may be considered a spammy post now, 'cause I get my batteries from them, and they're great!

 

[gsmit1]

With a regulated mod, the DC-DC regulator circuit sees what power (wattage) you've asked it for. Assuming available voltage (pressure) and amperage (current) in the batteries to meet the request, it manipulates (regulates) the voltage in order to send that wattage.

As the batteries drain, the regulator begins to draw more current in order to maintain the falling voltage and hence the requested wattage. When the voltage falls below the cutoff point of the circuit because of now insufficient amperage, you get the low battery warning.

I think I have that all straight

 

[gsmit1]

Lower resistance requires more wattage (power) to generate the same heat.

Rub your hands together while pressing them against each other hard. You will quickly begin to feel the heat. High resistance.

Now rub them together, but don't press as hard. You'll have to move them a lot faster to get the same level of heat. Lower resistance.

An imperfect, but I believe useful analogy. In a very real way, heating a resistance element like a vape coil is caused by electrical friction at the atomic level.

 

[wizdumb1]

Hello @wizdumb1, I just checked for you with an ohms law calculator and with those values you're pulling over 26 Amps.

The values you need for calculations are.

Watts = Power

Resistance = Ohms

Here's a link to an online ohms law calculator.

Ohms Law Calculator

And here's a link to @Mooch's blog, he's our resident battery guru who helps us reduce our risks.

Mooch's blog | E-Cigarette Forum

But if you were considering some more 18650 cells to add in the rotation the Molicel P28A cells may be of interest.

And your atomiser is slow to heat and slow to cool, because of the mass of your coil build.

You would possibly be able to reduce the mass by increasing the surface area of the coil in contact with the wicking, by using a flat multi core Clapton type coil made with thinner wire. But it's trial and error to find out what works best for you.

Is this 26 amps split between 2 batteries?

 

[gsmit1]

Is this 26 amps split between 2 batteries?

Forgive my interjection please.

Almost every regulated multi-battery mod is wired in series.

Series = the combined voltage of the number of batteries, but the capacity and amperage of a single battery.

Parallel = the combined amperage and capacity of the number of batteries, but the voltage of a single.

 

[wizdumb1]

Thanks Everyone! So going through this and a little extra looking around I assume AngeNZ's post is the right answer. I was using N80 Fused Clapton 28*3 +36 6 wraps before. I'll have to find something else because this isn't doing it for me.

 

[Mordacai]

On second thoughts @wizdumb1, Samsung 20S would probably be the best fit then as a cell choice.

As at the moment your stressing those cells you're using at the moment then, and thanks for confirming what I was trying to remember.

As a series mod is much cheaper and easier for a manufacturer to make over a parallel one, but this information is never disclosed by manufacturer on their product pages in their specifications.

So resistance is still extremely important with regulated mods, as the circuitry isn't designed to monitor if the batteries aren't being stressed.

So saying that resistance is unimportant with regulated mods, especially with low ohm builds and using cells with the wrong ratings is extremely dangerous.

So it's possible to use Panasonic NCR18650B cells with a CDR of 4.9 Amps in a regulated mod with a resistance of 0.12 ohms, but this would be an extremely risky proposition in a series mod like the Drag 2.

 

[AngeNZ]

Thanks Everyone! So going through this and a little extra looking around I assume AngeNZ's post is the right answer. I was using N80 Fused Clapton 28*3 +36 6 wraps before. I'll have to find something else because this isn't doing it for me.

Are you purchasing from Canadian stores or the US? @Punk In Drublic may have some sources for Canadian wire stores.

 

[AngeNZ]

On second thoughts @wizdumb1, Samsung 20S would probably be the best fit then as a cell choice.

As at the moment your stressing those cells you're using at the moment then, and thanks for confirming what I was trying to remember.

As a series mod is much cheaper and easier for a manufacturer to make over a parallel one, but this information is never disclosed by manufacturer on their product pages in their specifications.

So resistance is still extremely important with regulated mods, as the circuitry isn't designed to monitor if the batteries aren't being stressed.

So saying that resistance is unimportant with regulated mods, especially with low ohm builds and using cells with the wrong ratings is extremely dangerous.

So it's possible to use Panasonic NCR18650B cells with a CDR of 4.9 Amps in a regulated mod with a resistance of 0.12 ohms, but this would be an extremely risky proposition in a series mod like the Drag 2.

People that understand a lot better than I do, have said that your coil resistance in a regulated mod isn't a factor with regard to calculating
battery draw:

from @Baditude 's blog entry:
(9) Battery Basics for Mods; the Ultimate Battery Guide | E-Cigarette Forum
and Calculating battery current draw for a regulated mod | E-Cigarette Forum

 

[Mooch]

Forgive my interjection please.

Almost every regulated multi-battery mod is wired in series.

Series = the combined voltage of the number of batteries, but the capacity and amperage of a single battery.

Parallel = the combined amperage and capacity of the number of batteries, but the voltage of a single.

In a regulated mod though it doesn’t matter if the batteries are wired in series or in parallel, the current drawn from each street is the same.