Old Coils, rust, bad flavor, easier to gunk?

[Phone Guy]

I rewick pretty often, every tank or every other tank. My favorite juice (diy) seems to gunk up Coils quickly. So I dry burn and rewick.

After a few tanks the Coils look rusted or badly corroded. And it seems that when they are badly rusted or corroded (or whatever it is) after dry burning they seem to either taste bad and/or get gunked up much more quickly, after just a ml or two (half a 4.5-5.0ml tank at most)

How often do you guys recoil? Is it my juice? Am I crazy? Am I right?

Edit: I use kanthal a1 28g most of the time

 

[State O' Flux]

That's a awfully short life span for a 28 gauge A-1 build. Dark, thick sugary juice? Too low a heat flux value? Wrong wire for the resistance and wattage?
Any number of things, or combination of things will do it, but still... a few milliliters... that's excessive.

 

[Phone Guy]

The few ml is after the coil has been used for a week or so, and badly "corroded" or whatever is happening. It looks like rust almost. It gets this black corrosion and what I can only describe as what looks like rust to me?

So in summary, after the coil has been in use for several days or a week, and the coil is no longer silver looking but is black, it seems to gunk and taste burnt almost instantly.

 

[State O' Flux]

The few ml is after the coil has been used for a week or so, and badly "corroded" or whatever is happening. It looks like rust almost. It gets this black corrosion and what I can only describe as what looks like rust to me?

So in summary, after the coil has been in use for several days or a week, and the coil is no longer silver looking but is black, it seems to gunk and taste burnt almost instantly.

Kanthal A1 is comprised of iron/chromium/aluminum. You've "used up" the alumina (aluminum oxide) layer that acts as an electrical insulator, heat conductor... and an anti-corrosive protection for the iron/chromium content.
Once you see black and/or rust, that coil is over and done. Frequent dry burns and "cleaning" only serves to speed up the process.

 

[GrandSam]

It depends on my juice, build, and how high I'm firing the device. Typically, with fruit flavors that lack sweetener, I can go a solid 3 weeks-month without recoiling.
With dessert flavors, I usually toss in a new coil after 2 or 3 weeks. Mind you, this is on a dripper.

 

[Lord Vaako]

Kanthal A1 is comprised of iron/chromium/aluminum. You've "used up" the alumina (aluminum oxide) layer that acts as an electrical insulator, heat conductor... and an anti-corrosive protection for the iron/chromium content.
Once you see black and/or rust, that coil is over and done. Frequent dry burns and "cleaning" only serves to speed up the process.

+100^^^THIS^^^^

Forget sticky - every vape shop should be posting this on every wire item listed. No matter what type of wire you use, this is going to happen. And once that happens, you're inhaling dangerous ..... DO NOT USE IT ONCE IT'S BLACK AND CRUSTY. If you're using some of the high-end wires, they can not handle pulsing at high power. If your juice is doing that, just forget it and abandon the DIY route until you can figure out what you're doing wrong or what you're using that's crap. Go buy a known high-end juice that you know what's in it.

 

[Phone Guy]

I'm averaging a few days between re coiling.

 

[Rumi]

I'm averaging a few days between re coiling.

I'm in the same predicament as you phone guy but even faster. I abandoned tanks cause I would get the burn taste on the first or second day and by the third I began wheezing and coughing and phlem build up. So a clean coil helps prevent those problems but I'm getting tired of coiling so often. I'm trying different juices all the time to see if it helps but nothing so far seems to have made a difference besides some juices require cleaning faster. I use fruit and custard flavors mainly and sometimes add a little menthol. After the first dry burn it's a fast decline to death. If I'm lazy and go three days the smoker symptoms seem to return. Using 26 and 28 kanthol and tried different cottons including vaper choice cotton and rayon with no improvement. Any suggestions? Thinking of trying mesh or the temperature control wire next. Ugh the mesh looks like a PITA.

 

[Lord Vaako]

I'm in the same predicament as you phone guy but even faster. I abandoned tanks cause I would get the burn taste on the first or second day and by the third I began wheezing and coughing and phlem build up. So a clean coil helps prevent those problems but I'm getting tired of coiling so often. I'm trying different juices all the time to see if it helps but nothing so far seems to have made a difference besides some juices require cleaning faster. I use fruit and custard flavors mainly and sometimes add a little menthol. After the first dry burn it's a fast decline to death. If I'm lazy and go three days the smoker symptoms seem to return. Using 26 and 28 kanthol and tried different cottons including vaper choice cotton and rayon with no improvement. Any suggestions? Thinking of trying mesh or the temperature control wire next. Ugh the mesh looks like a PITA.

You're burning your juice. Certain juices are not good to sub-ohm if that's what you're doing. Try lowering your voltage if you're using a regulated device. Go as low as you can and move up until you find a sweet spot. You also might need to go to 30g. One or both of these should fix the problem. Also, make sure you're not burning your wick by vaping it when it's dry. You might not be dripping often enough - if you're using a kayfun (or similar device), your wick might not be drawing juice.

Cotton is fine and probably the easiest to wick fast. I've tried them all and there isn't much of a difference. I've been using Cotton Bacon because it comes in strips that I can manage a lot quicker and in a zip lock pouch, but it's all the same pretty much. It's not the wick though - it sounds like you're frying your juice. Is it a light juice, thin juice? What brand and ratio is it and what devices are you guys using?

 

[Lord Vaako]

I'm averaging a few days between re coiling.

I've never had to recoil anything that often so I'm curious what you're using for juice and devices? I can go almost a month and I'm using a 150w Sigelei and Praxis rotating between a Derringer, Plume Veil, and Hobo. For juices I mix Electrum Blonde 18mg and Gremlin Custard 24mg (both 50/50) and make a lot of vapor, so I'm not chain vaping - 1 or 2 hits max.

 

[Phone Guy]

I've never had to recoil anything that often so I'm curious what you're using for juice and devices? I can go almost a month and I'm using a 150w Sigelei and Praxis rotating between a Derringer, Plume Veil, and Hobo. For juices I mix Electrum Blonde 18mg and Gremlin Custard 24mg (both 50/50) and make a lot of vapor, so I'm not chain vaping - 1 or 2 hits max.

I'm using one of my DNA devices.. Either a DNA30 or DNA20. I'm on a tank system, I rarely drip. My tanks are squape Reloaded or taifun gt2 these days. KGD or muji cotton. Juice is 6mg DIY 50/50 or 70/30. Occasionally name brand juices (five pawns, the steam Co, suicide bunny) but not as often since I have a DIY recipe I enjoy as much.

 

[Lord Vaako]

Are you burning juice even when it's the name brand stuff? If so, we can eliminate the DIY blend as the problem. I have a feeling you could be running dry and burning your wick and it's giving you a burnt juice taste. Every hit will taste burnt if you burn the cotton even a little bit. If the cotton is too tight inside the coil - so you could either have a coil that's too tight of a diameter or the cotton is too tight inside the coil. On a tank system, I remember re-wicking everyday or every other day. Dripping I can go a lot longer - about a week with a Derringer and even longer (if I push it) with a Plume Veil. It might just be that you have to re-wick. What diameter and how many wraps are using for your coil? Also, what are your ohm's, volts, and watts? The other thing to watch out for with a tank system are the channels, so make sure that nothing is building up inside them that is blocking juice from flowing to the wick.

 

[Rumi]

You're burning your juice. Certain juices are not good to sub-ohm if that's what you're doing. Try lowering your voltage if you're using a regulated device. Go as low as you can and move up until you find a sweet spot. You also might need to go to 30g. One or both of these should fix the problem. Also, make sure you're not burning your wick by vaping it when it's dry. You might not be dripping often enough - if you're using a kayfun (or similar device), your wick might not be drawing juice.

Cotton is fine and probably the easiest to wick fast. I've tried them all and there isn't much of a difference. I've been

Are you burning juice even when it's the name brand stuff? If so, we can eliminate the DIY blend as the problem. I have a feeling you could be running dry and burning your wick and it's giving you a burnt juice taste. Every hit will taste burnt if you burn the cotton even a little bit. If the cotton is too tight inside the coil - so you could either have a coil that's too tight of a diameter or the cotton is too tight inside the coil. On a tank system, I remember re-wicking everyday or every other day. Dripping I can go a lot longer - about a week with a Derringer and even longer (if I push it) with a Plume Veil. It might just be that you have to re-wick. What diameter and how many wraps are using for your coil? Also, what are your ohm's, volts, and watts? The other thing to watch out for with a tank system are the channels, so make sure that nothing is building up inside them that is blocking juice from flowing to the wick.

I'm using one of my DNA devices.. Either a DNA30 or DNA20. I'm on a tank system, I rarely drip. My tanks are squape Reloaded or taifun gt2 these days. KGD or muji cotton. Juice is 6mg DIY 50/50 or 70/30. Occasionally name brand juices (five pawns, the steam Co, suicide bunny) but not as often since I have a DIY recipe I enjoy as much.

Are you burning juice even when it's the name brand stuff? If so, we can eliminate the DIY blend as the problem. I have a feeling you could be running dry and burning your wick and it's giving you a burnt juice taste. Every hit will taste burnt if you burn the cotton even a little bit. If the cotton is too tight inside the coil - so you could either have a coil that's too tight of a diameter or the cotton is too tight inside the coil. On a tank system, I remember re-wicking everyday or every other day. Dripping I can go a lot longer - about a week with a Derringer and even longer (if I push it) with a Plume Veil. It might just be that you have to re-wick. What diameter and how many wraps are using for your coil? Also, what are your ohm's, volts, and watts? The other thing to watch out for with a tank system are the channels, so make sure that nothing is building up inside them that is blocking juice from flowing to the wick.[/QUOTE
using Cotton Bacon because it comes in strips that I can manage a lot quicker and in a zip lock pouch, but it's all the same pretty much. It's not the wick though - it sounds like you're frying your juice. Is it a light juice, thin juice? What brand and ratio is it and what devices are you guys using?

Ok just put new coils. Running a single coil on an Odin @ . 51 ohms on a Peko and using a tight pack in the coil with the vapors choice cotton and fuzion vapor unicorn blood 6 mg nic. Unicorn blood does not list the ratio on the bottle but it is thin so high pg right ? New build on a nuppin @ 1.89 ohms single coil using on the vaper flask sqounker wicked with cellu cotton also packed tight in the coil. Same unicorn blood juice. the vapor flask reads 1.79 ohms at 20 watts, voltage changes between 5.97-6.8 when I fire. I'm not sure if the voltage changes during the inhale as the screen is too close to read. Maybe I can post a pic tomorrow and we will see what the gunk looks like. Appreciate the help, p.s. What is 30g? Gauge wire?

Are you burning juice even when it's the name brand stuff? If so, we can eliminate the DIY blend as the problem. I have a feeling you could be running dry and burning your wick and it's giving you a burnt juice taste. Every hit will taste burnt if you burn the cotton even a little bit. If the cotton is too tight inside the coil - so you could either have a coil that's too tight of a diameter or the cotton is too tight inside the coil. On a tank system, I remember re-wicking everyday or every other day. Dripping I can go a lot longer - about a week with a Derringer and even longer (if I push it) with a Plume Veil. It might just be that you have to re-wick. What diameter and how many wraps are using for your coil? Also, what are your ohm's, volts, and watts? The other thing to watch out for with a tank system are the channels, so make sure that nothing is building up inside them that is blocking juice from flowing to the wick.

. Today's test is using the tight packed coil as the loose coil test showed no improvement and I noticed a metallic taste quickly and assumed I was burning something.

 

[Lord Vaako]

Thanks for summarizing everything Rumi.

Yes, 30g is 30 gauge wire. I have to say I didn't realize how popular those flasks became. I never thought anyone would buy them with the Sigelei 150w available for half the $. I'm noticing that you have a ton of voltage but very little wattage and I don't think this is good for your batteries. Are you sure that your mod is even working properly? If I crank my Sigelei 150w up to 150w, on freshly charged authentic Sony VTC4's (yes, I'm positive they are real), I'll hit my maximum voltage with a .2ohm build (dual parallel coil build w/26g g-plat elite). Now, that won't fry my 50/50 juice, but I will go through juice quickly and then burn the wick if I fire it long enough. I then took two of my old variable voltage Provaris and attached a 1.5ohm cartomizer and tank and filled one with my juice (gremlin custard mixed with electrum blonde 50/50) and the other with the thinnest sample juice I could find (never tried Unicorn) and cranked them up to 6v. Both fried the juice on fresh cartomizers.

I haven't used your tank build, but remember that most tank set ups have insulators that can melt. You'll have a short if that happens so be careful if you try a mech mod. The metal taste might be from a fresh coil that wasn't dry burned enough. Your cotton should be able to be pulled through the coil snuggly - snug to the point where it doesn't move the coil when you pull on either end of the cotton.

Lastly, this morning I did a search on this flask for my own interest on the ECF to try and figure why people are even buying the flask (considering the price, the low wattage output of the chip, and the reliability of the Sigelei 150w). I found a post from Phone Guy talking about altering his mod:

https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/f...-op-round-6-co-op.666246/page-8#post-15685683

While I don't think this is bad, I've been vaping for almost 6 years and I've never done that. Do people do it and build their own mods from scratch? Yes. But if you have the $ to buy a $300 vapor flask, why mess with it? Especially now, there are so many products out there that are cheap, have been tested, and work great. I'm not trying to be critical of you or what you bought - I really want to help you to be honest. But if you don't know that 30g = 30 gauge, what are the chances that you correctly modified this device without damaging something? Maybe you did it right and just have a defective part. Just be careful. There are so many variables involved that could be causing your problem. It could be any combination of things we've covered and it's hard to diagnose without holding it in your hand. If you have a mech mod (that I pray you haven't altered), try it on that and see if it's still happening. Then you'll know if it's your flask. If it is your flask and you did alter it, I would probably replace it.

Everyone needs to realize that even this forum isn't the same place it was 2-3 years ago. There are a ton of people vaping now and everyone (even me) wants to take it a step further - because we're all tinkerers by nature. Not everyone knows what they're doing. Also remember that regardless of a members rating (veteran, senior member, etc.), it doesn't mean that what they are telling you is 100% of the story. People with experience can inadvertently leave things out that they assume is basic knowledge and then someone makes a mistake and doesn't know why they have a problem.

 

[Rumi]

Thanks for summarizing everything Rumi.

Yes, 30g is 30 gauge wire. I have to say I didn't realize how popular those flasks became. I never thought anyone would buy them with the Sigelei 150w available for half the $. I'm noticing that you have a ton of voltage but very little wattage and I don't think this is good for your batteries. Are you sure that your mod is even working properly? If I crank my Sigelei 150w up to 150w, on freshly charged authentic Sony VTC4's (yes, I'm positive they are real), I'll hit my maximum voltage with a .2ohm build (dual parallel coil build w/26g g-plat elite). Now, that won't fry my 50/50 juice, but I will go through juice quickly and then burn the wick if I fire it long enough. I then took two of my old variable voltage Provaris and attached a 1.5ohm cartomizer and tank and filled one with my juice (gremlin custard mixed with electrum blonde 50/50) and the other with the thinnest sample juice I could find (never tried Unicorn) and cranked them up to 6v. Both fried the juice on fresh cartomizers.

I haven't used your tank build, but remember that most tank set ups have insulators that can melt. You'll have a short if that happens so be careful if you try a mech mod. The metal taste might be from a fresh coil that wasn't dry burned enough. Your cotton should be able to be pulled through the coil snuggly - snug to the point where it doesn't move the coil when you pull on either end of the cotton.

Lastly, this morning I did a search on this flask for my own interest on the ECF to try and figure why people are even buying the flask (considering the price, the low wattage output of the chip, and the reliability of the Sigelei 150w). I found a post from Phone Guy talking about altering his mod:

https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/f...-op-round-6-co-op.666246/page-8#post-15685683

While I don't think this is bad, I've been vaping for almost 6 years and I've never done that. Do people do it and build their own mods from scratch? Yes. But if you have the $ to buy a $300 vapor flask, why mess with it? Especially now, there are so many products out there that are cheap, have been tested, and work great. I'm not trying to be critical of you or what you bought - I really want to help you to be honest. But if you don't know that 30g = 30 gauge, what are the chances that you correctly modified this device without damaging something? Maybe you did it right and just have a defective part. Just be careful. There are so many variables involved that could be causing your problem. It could be any combination of things we've covered and it's hard to diagnose without holding it in your hand. If you have a mech mod (that I pray you haven't altered), try it on that and see if it's still happening. Then you'll know if it's your flask. If it is your flask and you did alter it, I would probably replace it.

Everyone needs to realize that even this forum isn't the same place it was 2-3 years ago. There are a ton of people vaping now and everyone (even me) wants to take it a step further - because we're all tinkerers by nature. Not everyone knows what they're doing. Also remember that regardless of a members rating (veteran, senior member, etc.), it doesn't mean that what they are telling you is 100% of the story. People with experience can inadvertently leave things out that they assume is basic knowledge and then someone makes a mistake and doesn't know why they have a problem.

I appreciate all help since my first assumption is that I am doing something incorrectly. I did not do any modifications to the mod. It was bought as a sqounker/ bottom feeder and I paid that price because it was the only regulated sqounker available in the past 3 months, pre made and made in USA. Vapor Flask Squonk DNA 40 2.1S (Black Top) The evolve dna instructions are short and I've only figured out how to adjust the watts which seems to automatically adjust the volts for you. I did not consider that 20 watts was too high as many devices can go much higher . Build on my ohm reader was 1.89, is this too low ohms? I see people building .3 ohms and lower. My Peko came pre made and is mechanical and is running the .51 ohms. The attys made for sqounkers have smaller airflow than my dripping attys so maybe I am frying the juice.

 

[Phone Guy]

Here's a picture of a 1.5 ohm coil of 28g on a 3mm screwdriver. In use for less than a week, not sure how many actual tanks, since this is my SqR and I've been favoring my Taifun GT 2 lately... So a week is more a time frame of being installed rather than in use (if you understand)

This is right now after a dry burn. I'll guess not more than 4 to 6 tanks of use at the most. This is my flask with a genuine dna20 (yes 20, that's all I had available to install) so a maximum of 20w were pushed thru this coil. (probably more like 15w)

 

[zoiDman]

Here's a picture of a 1.5 ohm coil of 28g on a 3mm screwdriver. In use for less than a week, not sure how many actual tanks, since this is my SqR and I've been favoring my Taifun GT 2 lately... So a week is more a time frame of being installed rather than in use (if you understand)

This is right now after a dry burn. I'll guess not more than 4 to 6 tanks of use at the most. This is my flask with a genuine dna20 (yes 20, that's all I had available to install) so a maximum of 20w were pushed thru this coil. (probably more like 15w)

That is a Strange Looking coil!

If I didn't know that the Coil was made out of Kanthal A1, I would say that it had a Layer of Iron Oxide on it. But the problem is that Kanthal A1 has 20.5 ~ 23.5 % Chromium in it.

MatWeb - The Online Materials Information Resource

And that high amount of Chromium (Higher than all but the Highest Chromium Stainless Steels) will inhibited the formation of Iron Oxides. So my Next guess would be that the Tan Colored "Stuff" is Residual Burnt e-Liquid.

Does it flake off Easily when Poked with something Metal?

 

[Rumi]

I appreciate all help since my first assumption is that I am doing something incorrectly. I did not do any modifications to the mod. It was bought as a sqounker/ bottom feeder and I paid that price because it was the only regulated sqounker available in the past 3 months, pre made and made in USA. Vapor Flask Squonk DNA 40 2.1S (Black Top) The evolve dna instructions are short and I've only figured out how to adjust the watts which seems to automatically adjust the volts for you. I did not consider that 20 watts was too high as many devices can go much higher . Build on my ohm reader was 1.89, is this too low ohms? I see people building .3 ohms and lower. My Peko came pre made and is mechanical and is running the .51 ohms. The attys made for sqounkers have smaller airflow than my dripping attys so maybe I am frying the juice.

 

[Rumi]

Looks black to me gonna clean now. Went through about 15 ml of juic on the flask and about 10 ml on the peko.

 

[Rumi]

Looks black to me gonna clean now. Went through about 15 ml of juic on the flask and about 10 ml on the peko.

The Odin build is trash after 1 day rusty.