My thoughts about sub-ohm and latest VV/VW devices...

[Ablonz]

All I have to do is say a BIG THANK YOU!!!!! That was a Very informative read.... Now to get on with my build on my rda Subtank, of course I just read this after I made a 26 twisted coil @ .6 ohms. Maybe try to make a twisted 32 @ 1.4 ohm there abouts. and thin out my juice a little bit since mine are all 30PG/70VG and wick a little slow. I knew there was a reason for me buying my sigelei 100 watt

 

[Ablonz]

I just threw together a 2.5 mm 15 wrap dual @ 1.0 ohm 40 watts single coil on my Sigelei that blew a better cloud than my dual coil .3ohm Mech Mod. to the OP!!!!!

 

[ukeman]

I was joking ukeman.

ˆ'm not so smart cloud, thats why i took so long getting back from the darrrk side

 

[ukeman]

I have been debating trying a vv/vw mod. I like a higher resistance coil so I am sold. I did not read the whole thread but what is a good wattage device? There are so many to choose from!

anything that goes over 4 volts...
although you can use a mech too; 1 ohms at 4 volts i.e. is not bad at all.

I love dna evolve because they go up to 8 or 9 volts on some chips.
Normal use is 4.5 to 6.5v even with a 2.5 Ohms coil in my experience... anywhere from 10 to 20watts for me is enough.

fwiw the new dna25 should be wonderfully sufficient (although we're talking temp protection arena which is the new game in town +1) it will give you normal vv/vw and TP.

although TP mode uses nickle wire and super low resistance, the same type of dynamics apply but on a different back drop.
i use 30g Ni200 10 to 12 wraps and about 20watts (400 to 440 degrees)

 

[vince01]

What a great post, a must read for anyone considering moving on from typical beginners set ups and a timely reminder for more experienced vapers who have got carried away with the whole sub ohm culture
Kudos man

 

[chewster]

Excellent write-up. Very well explained and written. And I did read the entire thing.

I too enjoy physics so very technical descriptions of processes are right up my alley.

TL/DR: The delayed choice quantum eraser experiment is super cool!!!

I couldn't agree more on that. It would be extremely interesting to find the limits of when 'knowledge' of the which-path component actually causes the waveform to collapse. I would love to see experiments designed with decreasingly complex lifeforms that test this effect. It is surely astonishing that this works when people are used as the observers, but I would wonder if the same would apply to apes, dogs, chickens, beetles, or bacteria.

At which evolutionary point is an observer classified as an observer in quantum mechanics? Do you need to know what the observation means in order to trigger retro-causality or simply react to it in some physical way?

Or perhaps the creation of an alternate universe only happens once the observer decides to interpret the which-path component. Maybe the waveform never truly collapses but instead branches into multiple and separate universes at that exact moment thereby preserving causality. If you think of a intact waveform as overlapping multiple universes then the past isn't changed when they dissociate into separate ones and causality remains intact.

Anyway, my head hurts now and this is extremely off topic, so.... Yeah, great post on sub-ohming!

 

[BigEgo]

The "paradox" is only a conflict between reality and your feeling of what reality "ought to be." -- Richard Feynman, in The Feynman Lectures on Physics, vol III, p. 18-9 (1965)

I think I can safely say that nobody understands quantum mechanics. --Richard Feynman, in The Character of Physical Law (1965)

Feynman said this in the 60's. Neils Bohr made a similar comment many years before that. Here we are in 2015 and we are still no closer to understanding QM. Yes, there has been progress in the science and math, but no real understanding of what it means. The popular hypothesis now is the multiple universe theory (first proposed in the 50's but now seeing a resurgence).

 

[sparkey909w]

Excellent write up I have only used the VV/VW mods and so far love them

 

[Oberon75]

Good stuff although these rules are changing now that we are getting into temperature control. A DNA 40 won't even work with a nickel build above 1 ohm

Sent from my HTC One M8 Harman/Kardon edition

 

[Ca Ike]

Good stuff although these rules are changing now that we are getting into temperature control. A DNA 40 won't even work with a nickel build above 1 ohm

Sent from my HTC One M8 Harman/Kardon edition

Really only applies to kanthan/ni- chrome builds. Funny thing is you actually have better temp control via power settings if you build int the 1.5-2.5 range. I've been working on a temp/power chart using different gauges and ohms in my spare time just for my own curiosity.

 

[Imperialchugger]

was directed to op's post from another thread. definitely a good read.

 

[mamabear15]

I love this post. I keep coming back to it and finding more "thought paths" to travel down every time. Heehee the base point was always common sense to me (sub ohm, why, just increase voltage-) but the practicality of how you broke it down - tied together surface area, etc - this is exactly why I love vaping, I get a sort of mental shinyitis on things like this where most people buy new devices, I wanna understand everything before I buy a dang thing LOL but it also bites me in the bum because I've yet to build my first coil, I got a lesson from a b&m guy who way oversimplified, and is the classic "sub ohm fan" in your example - didn't cut it for me at all. I was questioning my own understanding til I read your post! Thank you!! Now - to determine what gauge wire, etc I personally want to use to try this out...

 

[JahLove7124]

Mamabear, don't be intimidated by coil building. I'm the same way as you, I like to do as much research as possible before jumping into anything. I watched countless videos and read hundreds of threads before I started vaping almost a year and a half ago. As I'm sure you know, YouTube is a great place to watch coil building videos. I suggest using 28 gauge kanthal at first. In my opinion it's a good happy medium gauge. Easy to do sub ohm and 1 ohm range builds. Good luck!

 

[BigDvon91]

Awesome read! Thank you for that.

 

[Kasanova]

I have been absent from this site for many, many months now, I agree with you 100% on everything you said. I myself, have various 50+ watt devices, and guess what ohms I love building? 1.1-1.9, that's right!!!! all my friends make fun of me, but there is not point, like you said, to build ultra low for great cloud production with these regulated high wattage devices. It is all about surface area, air flow and wicking. Standing applause for you!!

 

[mamabear15]

Thanks JahLove! I'm right now loving 1.2-1.8 stock coils...believe it or not, I vary that by juice, I swear they taste different. Even keeping the wattage the same in the same protank, a 1.2 at 6 watts (3.3v) tastes good on some juices and love it, then switch flavors (clean, etc of course) and try the same setup and be totally disappointed, but try that new juice in a 1.8 at the same 6 watts (higher voltage of course) and it's perfect - now, none of that applies to my subtank LOL but hey that's a new acquisition I'm still playing around with the quirks of ;-) point is, I never understood why - had honestly wondered if I was just nuts - til I read your post about surface area, net temp, etc and realized that's probably why my preferences are so wide!!

 

[mamabear15]

I will definitely try the 28 gauge on my next build (aka next long weekend off work) thanks for the advice on a good place to start!!

 

[zachdelaro]

Glad I found this thread. Have an IPV2 and 24g wire that I couldn't get to work out well with a 50watt cap.

Just did a 26g 15 wrap dual coil over a 2.4mm screwdriver and all I can say is god-dayum!

 

[Frito]

OK, just found this thread and it makes for some really interesting reading, and makes me rethink everything I have learned so far about my vaping set up. I don't use mechs much any more since I went with regulated devices, but I've still been building my coils just like I was using a mech. I'll describe my current setup and my proposed new setup and see if I'm understanding this correctly.

Using an RDA I'm using 24g dual coil, 6 wraps, for a .3 ohm build. I usually run it at about 70 watts. From what I've taken away from this thread we should concentrate more on surface area and heat flux than the actual ohm build. According to Steam Engine my regular build should have a heat flux of 258. If I switch to a 28g dual coil with 16 wraps and up my wattage to 100 watts I'll have a heat flux of 261, or about the same as my regular build, but with much more surface area, and less strain and my batteries. Am I getting this right? Getting ready to play with some wire today.

 

[ukeman]

OK, just found this thread and it makes for some really interesting reading, and makes me rethink everything I have learned so far about my vaping set up. I don't use mechs much any more since I went with regulated devices, but I've still been building my coils just like I was using a mech. I'll describe my current setup and my proposed new setup and see if I'm understanding this correctly.

Using an RDA I'm using 24g dual coil, 6 wraps, for a .3 ohm build. I usually run it at about 70 watts. From what I've taken away from this thread we should concentrate more on surface area and heat flux than the actual ohm build. According to Steam Engine my regular build should have a heat flux of 258. If I switch to a 28g dual coil with 16 wraps and up my wattage to 100 watts I'll have a heat flux of 261, or about the same as my regular build, but with much more surface area, and less strain and my batteries. Am I getting this right? Getting ready to play with some wire today.

? just a minor glitch to my mind there, because without running any figures, my experience shows that a more satisfactory vape with the longer coil won't require as much as 100w.
I look at it more from a voltage increase... and less watts.
You're vaping 70w and probably about 4v...
Increase the resistance and the voltage, but not the watts and get a better vape because of the surface area, cool down, etc.
I'm often amazed the watts (and effort of batt) is low.