Clones VS The Real Deal...

[Asbestos4004]

A Vamo made me realize I like the performance of a mod...then I bought a ProVari. I love it. I wouldn't have spent the money on a ProVari not knowing if it made a difference or not. I did the same with mechs. Clones have led me to the originals...or they saved me from wasting my money on something I didn't like. For example, I thought I would love bottom buttons on a mech. I bought a cheapo and it turns out I hate bottom buttons. I like side buttons. I was thinking NZonic before the little test but went with EA. I'm not "for" clones ...but I've taken advantage of them.

 

[Asbestos4004]

Not trying to be preachy gents and ladies... I just don't get these circular arguments. No one... and I defy anyone to tell me they do, buys only originals.

One one hand... support the artist!!! On the other, ah... I can support the artist - to a point... then it's time to get practical.

You may not even realize when you buy, a lamp for example, that someone, somewhere designed that lamp, and it may very well be a copy of a highly desirable, and costly original. Did you buy the original $4000 lamp, or the $300 copy? I'm betting, unless you're filthy rich, the copy.

I have a chair in my office that was originally designed by Chas & Ray Eames in the mid 1950s, called a "La Chaise Chair". A "licensed designer version" (what ever the hell that is) is about $4K-$8K. My exceptionally well made, authentic but unlicensed, copy cost $900. Do I care? Not one whit.
The designers are dead, and the "licensed designer version" poofs can suck it for all I care... they are trading off the name of two very creative, but very dead, guys. The Eames descendants can suck it too. They are making money off of minds... not their own.

Not being preachy... nor do I want to argue just for the sake of argument. I'm just being realistic in a world where we, or rather 99.9% of us, can't afford not to.

Christ... how the hell to I get caught up in this stuff? I'm sooo outa here. Forums are for fun... not climbing on the backs of others to reach some unreachable moral high-ground.

I've never sat in a $900 chair...but I really want to. My .... is envious of yours.

 

[Zanza]

Everyone who owns a gennie, please raise your hand.
Everyone who only owns gennies either made by Raidy or made with his permission, lower your hand.
Those who still have their hand raised: Please stop moralizing about clones.

Raidy has offered to the public domain his Genesis invention, do your homework before talking

 

[havoc1967]

It is mind boggling to me that this topic continues to come up and people get so fired up about it. If you have the money and want a high end mod then go for it. I cannot tell you how little I care what you spend your money on. Makes you happy is all that matters. However, please do not attack those who buy clones because they certainly have their reasons as well. I call mine a Chentinel and a Chiablo because I do not pretend for one second they are the real deal. They work for me though. Might be better if the clones didn't copy the logos though but hey, I have no control over that.
People need to let this silly topic die out.

 

[grindle]

Raidy has offered to the public domain his Genesis invention, do your homework before talking

Yup, he offered it up to the users to create their own. He didn't want businesses taking his invention. The businesses that did take the invention rationalised it by saying "Well, we're not selling them pre-made or set up in any way...!"

Raidy is not happy about that. Do your homework before talking.

He should've expected it though, very naive of him, maybe due to the relatively small size of the community at the time he was a little blinkered as to how profit-motive would take precedence in vaping.

 

[minimalsaint]

LOL still with this?

 

[WattWick]

LOL still with this?

If it's below you just move along. No need for insults.

 

[Strongbeard]

I remember when (not that long ago) saving money was one of my main objectives for starting this "hobby"....

.......And then I started Vaping.

So here is my >> Clones should be acceptable as long as they don't copy the logos. Some clones do work extremely well, and some can be built better than the originals. But when you get into an EXACT copy of a mod, not just the size and shape... it gets a little ridiculous.

Do we really need 12 different clones of the fricken' Chi You?? I swear some of them are clones of the clones.

Me personally, I like the status symbol. I like knowing the one in my hand is a "REAL" one and not a photocopy. But I'm not going judge people who buy the less expensive clones. More power to them for trying to save money!!

 

[WattWick]

I remember when (not that long ago) saving money was one of my main objectives for starting this "hobby"....

.......And then I started Vaping.

So here is my >> Clones should be acceptable as long as they don't copy the logos. Some clones do work extremely well, and some can be built better than the originals. But when you get into an EXACT copy of a mod, not just the size and shape... it gets a little ridiculous.

Do we really need 12 different clones of the fricken' Chi You?? I swear some of them are clones of the clones.

Me personally, I like the status symbol. I like knowing the one in my hand is a "REAL" one and not a photocopy. But I'm not going judge people who buy the less expensive clones. More power to them for trying to save money!!

Would you say your wallet is being... exterminated?

Couldn't help it. Love your avatar

 

[Valhalla17]

This seems to be an ongoing debate. Some people are COMPLETELY against clones and do not condone the manufacturing or selling of them, and others do not see a problem with it.

I have been in the Mech world for a short time, about 2 or so months. Since then I have bought nothing but cheaper mods: the Magneto & Chi You Clone, and one 'authentic' in the Reo Grand with the RM2. Of the 3 the Magneto and Chi are without question my favorites. The Grand being my only authentic mod, yet being my least favorite definitely raises some 'brows (at least, for me).

I have some money and am willing for fork it out for a really nice authentic mod, however I honestly do not know if I can do it. Other than just being able to say that I have a REAL Chi/Nemesis/Caravela etc, what's the real benefit? I can buy 4 Nemesis clones for the price of 1 real one, and let's be honest, they probably vape damn near the same.

To those who have both, clones and the real deal; do you find it was worth it to fork out the $200+ for an authentic device? I will be selling my Reo just as soon as I can get verified and I will have a dilemma on my hands lol. Buy a couple clones and cloned atty's, or buy 1 authentic device.

At a local B&M they have a mod called the "Grenade". I haven't seen it anywhere but there, its absolutely awesome looking, heavy, seems well made. It has it's own little 'serial number' etc. BUT it goes for $230. I use all my Mechs on the go and have very little discipline to actually just keep a nice one at home to use on occasion. I am one that believes I should do the most vaping from my best/favorite device. That's another reason I struggle spending so much cash on an authentic.

I'd like to hear your guys thoughts. If there is a mod that is worth your money, i'd also like to hear what it is and why.

Thanks!

Clones allow alot of people to try mechs. Personally, there is no way I would have spent $100-$200 dollars on high end mechs when I started vaping as I didn't really know whether I would like them and just wanted to learn. Now I've become a big fan, see and appreciate the difference in high end and cheap so really have no use for clones anymore. But I appreciate them for what they are, cheap copies. Both have there place, without the cheap stuff I never would have discovered what I really like.

 

[minimalsaint]

If it's below you just move along. No need for insults.

Easy there, fella. My follow up post was going to be an awesome analogy of originals vs clones and Volkswagen vs. Ferrari.
My sincerest apologies if my LOL insulted you.

 

[Kevo56]

The thing that bothers me the most, is that if you do decide to buy an authentic device, there's no guarantee that you are actually getting one. I was looking at a Chi You at a local B&M and was assured that it was the real deal by two different people. They even pointed out the logo and said you could tell it was real, and it comes with a little badge that supposedly means it's real. The thing is, EVERY picture I've seen of authentic Chi You mods on the web the logo is different than the ones in the store. Plus, they are charging over $200 for them!

 

[State O' Flux]

I've never sat in a $900 chair...but I really want to. My .... is envious of yours.

They look like a melted torture device... but they, well - mine at least, is actually pretty comfy.

I bought this back when I was making big money... one of the few things I hung on to after cancer reduced my "big money" to a big stack of .50 cent off coupons for a 12 pack of Top Ramen noodles.

 

[State O' Flux]

Would you say your wallet is being... exterminated?

Couldn't help it. Love your avatar

No kidding... just saw it. Great! I'm surprised by the number of vapist/Dr. Who lovers here. Or... maybe I shouldn't be surprised at all. ;-)

 

[Scarey]

No kidding... just saw it. Great! I'm surprised by the number of vapist/Dr. Who lovers here. Or... maybe I shouldn't be surprised at all. ;-)

The first thing my brother noticed about my Vision spinner/protank mini II was that it looked like a sonic screwdriver. I wonder when the sonic screwdriver mod will come out. Not a far stretch, since there are plenty of regular screwdrivers.

 

[Coldpunk]

The thing that bothers me the most, is that if you do decide to buy an authentic device, there's no guarantee that you are actually getting one. I was looking at a Chi You at a local B&M and was assured that it was the real deal by two different people. They even pointed out the logo and said you could tell it was real, and it comes with a little badge that supposedly means it's real. The thing is, EVERY picture I've seen of authentic Chi You mods on the web the logo is different than the ones in the store. Plus, they are charging over $200 for them!

This is why I won't buy a mod that has been cloned from anyone but the manufacturer. For example I'm not buying a chi you, king mod, or vw nemesis anywhere. These clones recently are 1:1 copies.

 

[onjre]

I'm just waiting for the vamo clone to come out. Hopefully they'll sell for $2 and have fixed the threading problem on the original.

 

[onjre]

Just so everyone knows. Even if you get a patent on something in the USA, this does not prevent a Chinese company (legally) from copying your product and selling it. You can try to get them to stop importing it but if it's coming through customs in single packages it's going to be hard to stop.

That maker can also get a patent in China but usually (not sure about China in particular) that maker would have to also "open shop" in China for the patent to be honored, i.e. you need to show that you are benefiting the country in which you have the patent. You can't get a patent in China and do nothing with it (there) and just prevent anyone else from making a clone.

A patent is designed to give you a market advantage (a monopoly for 20 years) on a particular design. This allows you to recoup costs on development and innovation. << This is the key here. We WANT people to build on previous work but we also want to protect the developers who fork over lots of time and money to make it better.

I can license a patent as well and make the same thing. Does that make it a clone? Everyone is happy and we make identical products and the inventor gets royalties.

But this is not always advantageous. Take that laptop you're looking at right now. Everything about it has a patent on it but rest assured they're not all payed royalties. Why not? It's been around a while and the holder of the patent isn't so .... as to enforce it (thinking of the recent samsung/apple ). This means most electronics you use are technically clones (yes even apple). When a patent holds back innovation and progress it is no longer serving its purpose. Generally you can make a similar copy and the patent holder will let it slide. (But if it's made in China and there is no patent in China it's not illegal at all)

 

[crazyarms]

My first mech was a k101 and it was pretty awesome. My buddy was using some egos for a while and saw my mod and decided he HAD to get one. I took him to the local vapor shop, he picked up a brand new sentinel mod. Needless to say i was jealous. I then found some sentinel clones online and decided to try them out. Bought 2 of them because at $13 you have to buy 2. Took a while to arrive but they seriously hit better than his legitimate sentinel. Since then he bought a GMS and loves it and i recently purchased an atom.

Needless to say, i have faith in the clone game in terms of functionality. Aesthetically, not at all. These sentinel clones showed threads if using an 18650 and you could tell they were made in China. Id definitely buy clones again for beater mods or recommend them to friends wanting to try mechanical out but you really just cant beat the quality of the real mods. Just my 2 cents!

 

[Valhalla17]

My first mech was a Sigelei 19 and turned out to be the worse one Ive ever seen. Then a Sentinel clone which was adequate. Then an Nzonic V3 which opened my eyes, then a Poldiac. There's nothing like the high end ones, but I needed to try the clones to get me there.