Philip Morris buys patent for nicotine aerosol technology, may be better than e-cigarettes

[Nicko]

I think no vapor would be a huge WIN in many situations. I could use it on a plane, a bus, a train, in my parent's house, absolutely anywhere, and nobody (especially anti-smoking bigots) would have the slightest reason to say, or even think that I shouldn't be doing it. All other times, I would vape my e-cig.

It is the visible vapor coming from our mouths that the anti-smokers can NOT and probably will NEVER accept as normal behaviour. Even if they accept it's not smoke, and even if they accept it's not harmful, they just hate to see vapor or smoke coming from anyone's mouth. It disgusts them, especially if we look like we are enjoying it. I honestly doubt if this will change in the near future.

I hope the new product is developed and marketed as soon as possible. It sounds like the ultimate in stealth vaping.

 

[Vap0rJay]

I think no vapor would be a huge WIN in many situations.

Then use a patch? Chew the gum? Thats the argument...
I'm in no way supporting anti's -- but as soon as you say no vapor, they gotchabytheballz!

Besides, if I want no vapor... i just take a smaller draw and hold it in a little longer. Poof, little to no vapor

 

[Traver]

The only way PM can turn a profit on its investment (of buying the patent) is to make/sell lots of the products at a lower cost than cigarettes.

Or they can keep it off the market and continue to sell cigarettes as long as possible. Nor do they have to sell it for less than cigarettes. They can advertise it as a healthier alternative and charge more. Just depends one where they see the biggest profit.
If they do market them I think another alternative to smoking is a good thing. It will good for vapors because it will make pv's and vaping more acceptable to the public.

 

[sqirl1]

another thing tobacco companies should do is stop messing with cigarettes to make them more addictive! people like smoking but with cigarettes these days it's all or nothing; for the most part you're either addicted or you don't smoke them at all. they don't do this to pipe tobacco and cigars generally speaking and people still smoke them because they enjoy it, why do cigarettes have to be so different?

 

[KevNewEngland]

another thing tobacco companies should do is stop messing with cigarettes to make them more addictive! people like smoking but with cigarettes these days it's all or nothing; for the most part you're either addicted or you don't smoke them at all. they don't do this to pipe tobacco and cigars generally speaking and people still smoke them because they enjoy it, why do cigarettes have to be so different?

Good point. I used to make my own smokes (RYO) and it was so much different than commercial death sticks. No added chemicals of any kind, just pure tobacco. I had quit that after a while and found it to be super easy compared to regular smokes. Then, I started smoking those mini cigars. (Cheyenne) Same thing, no chemicals and much easier to quit. When I started e cigs, within 2 days, I was happy with 8mg nic.

 

[Vocalek]

Then use a patch? Chew the gum? Thats the argument...
I'm in no way supporting anti's -- but as soon as you say no vapor, they gotchabytheballz!

Besides, if I want no vapor... i just take a smaller draw and hold it in a little longer. Poof, little to no vapor

I think Nicko has made an extremely valid point. It would be nice to have this alternative to use on a plane or some other place where they might happily arrest you if they caught you stealth vaping. As far as the "argument" you mention, it doesn't hold up. These are far more effective than patch or gum, which left me crazy for a cigarette during each plane trip before I began using my e-cig.

The results of this double-blind, randomized, cross-over study demonstrate that nicotine pyruvate inhalations produce rapid increases in plasma nicotine concentrations. In addition, nicotine pyruvate inhalation was well tolerated, and at the 20 μg/puff dose, significantly alleviated craving for cigarettes when compared with placebo. At this dose, peak nicotine concentrations were higher and harshness/irritation was rated lower than with the Nicotrol/Nicorette nicotine vapor inhaler.

BTW, in this study the NP product was compared to placebo (air) and the Nocotrol/Nicorette inhalor.

 

[BadThad]

This is but a first step of big tobacco headed toward the mfg of ecigs. While it is not a true ecig, it's a process that leads to it with some modification.

 

[kristin]

Remember the days when you could only find healthy or organic food in specialty stores? Consumers started buying those products as a healthier alternative. Did the big corporations buy out all the little companies just to remove the products from the market or did they just add them to their product lines to expand their market and increase their bottom line? Many also added their own organics to their line to compete. But they knew they had to keep the quality to keep the current customers and gain new ones as it became more popular.

It's very likely that Big Tobacco will simply become the "parent company" to successful e-cig companies, let them do their thing and make them money - same as Big Food did with organics. If they do their market research, they'll find out what sells and what keeps us coming back and make sure they win us over and keep us as customers. Something to consider....

 

[DataPhreak]

We've actually known about this, but we thought it would be comming from big pharma, not big tobacco.

Original thread

To which, of course, i posted the material safety data sheet for pyruvic acid (Pyruvate; notice how they edited out the acid part)

http://www.sciencelab.com/msds.php?msdsId=9924778

Potential Acute Health Effects:
Very hazardous in case of skin contact (irritant), of eye contact (irritant), of ingestion, of inhalation. Hazardous in case of skin contact (corrosive), of eye contact (corrosive). Liquid or spray mist may produce tissue damage particularly on mucous membranes of eyes, mouth and respiratory tract. Skin contact may produce burns. Inhalation of the spray mist may produce severe irritation of respiratory tract, characterized by coughing, choking, or shortness of breath. Inflammation of the eye is characterized by redness, watering, and itching. Skin inflammation is characterized by itching, scaling, reddening, or, occasionally, blistering.
Potential Chronic Health Effects:
CARCINOGENIC EFFECTS: Not available. MUTAGENIC EFFECTS: Not available. TERATOGENIC EFFECTS: Not available.
DEVELOPMENTAL TOXICITY: Not available. Repeated or prolonged contact with spray mist may produce chronic eye
irritation and severe skin irritation. Repeated or prolonged exposure to spray mist may produce respiratory tract irritation leading to frequent attacks of bronchial infection.

In short, WTF?!!!?!??!

 

[Vocalek]

Perhaps there is something we are missing.

Differences Between Pyruvic Acid & Pyruvate | eHow.com

The abstract says they were using "nicotine pyruvate". Do you have a MSDS for that compound?

 

[Old Chemist]

Heyyy... DataPhreak - find the info (eg. MSDS) for hydrochloric acid. You'd be horrified - "Extremely corrosive. Inhalation of vapour can cause serious injury. Ingestion may be fatal. Liquid can cause severe damage to skin and eyes"
But you still use the salt of hydrochloric acid - it's called salt - sodium chloride.
The same applies to the pair pyruvic acid/pyruvate.

Hope it's a bit more clear now.

 

[DataPhreak]

Still not much better. Found sodium pyruvate, no nicotine pyruvate.

Potential Acute Health Effects:
Very hazardous in case of ingestion. Hazardous in case of skin contact (irritant), of inhalation. Slightly hazardous in case of
eye contact (irritant).
Potential Chronic Health Effects:
Very hazardous in case of ingestion. Hazardous in case of skin contact (irritant), of inhalation. Slightly hazardous in case of
eye contact (irritant).

http://www.sciencelab.com/msds.php?msdsId=9925031

I'm sure everyone here has had an E-cig leak in their mouth. Just so everyone knows the proper procedure incase one of these leaks in their mouth:

Ingestion:
Do not induce vomiting. Loosen tight clothing such as a collar, tie, belt or waistband. If the victim is not breathing, perform
mouth-to-mouth resuscitation. Seek immediate medical attention.

Sorry, still not touching it.

 

[JW50]

Here's a link to the patent (I believe, anyway)

United States Patent: 6121289

This thing is nothing like an E-cig, and has none of its attributes, in particular the flavoring and the vapor.

I don't think this is anything to worry about, its just a glorified nic inhaler.

I don't think that is the current patent. However, in looking for that patent I ran across the Woyzec. Here is a link to info about the Woyzec. Woyzek: Investors
This may be old information to many who have posted on this threat. But new info to me. On the surface it looks like a fancy box mod. But perhaps more involved. Does anyone know any more about this product? The info in this link does mention a US2008/0241255. That last reference may be the patent number. Also indicated is that the nicotine pyruvate system is "highly temperature dependent".

 

[Old Chemist]

Still not much better. Found sodium pyruvate, no nicotine pyruvate.
http://www.sciencelab.com/msds.php?msdsId=9925031

I'm sure everyone here has had an E-cig leak in their mouth. Just so everyone knows the proper procedure incase one of these leaks in their mouth:

Ingestion:
Do not induce vomiting. Loosen tight clothing such as a collar, tie, belt or waistband. If the victim is not breathing, perform
mouth-to-mouth resuscitation. Seek immediate medical attention.

Sorry, still not touching it.

Dear friend - don't get angry, but my frank personal opinion is - MSDSs should be studied by qualified personnel. Layman reading it might feel sick in a matter of seconds.
Pyruvate is a natural product that could be found in any human organism. It comes from glucose during the glycolysis process. Then it turns into acetyl CoA during decarboxylation process. All of those are absolutely natural.

 

[JW50]

More information on the patent application of the process mentioned in this thread can be found here: DEVICE AND METHOD FOR DELIVERY OF A MEDICAMENT - Patent application

A extract from this reference:
[0139]Without desiring to be bound by theory, it is believed that passing the vapor of a volatile first substance (i.e. a delivery enhancing compound) over a nicotine source results in the formation of particles in a liquid or solid state, which subsequently allows more of the nicotine to evaporate and combine with the first substance, generating further particles. The amount of particle formation (mass delivered) at a given temperature would be greater than that formed when the vapor of nicotine is passed over a second volatile substance. Similarly, the amount of particle formation at a given temperature would be greater than that formed when the vapors of the two substances are combined in a parallel mixing apparatus (as disclosed in prior art), due to the amount of particle formation being limited by the volatility of the less volatile substance and to the dilution of the active substance by mixing with the volume of gas containing the other substance. Also, allowing sequential passing of one substance over a second substance may allow for a more efficient combination of the two substances than parallel mixing as disclosed in prior art. Another possibility is that the interaction between the first and second substances is an exothermic process. In other words, energy is released in the form of heat as a result of the exothermic interaction. Without desiring to be bound by theory, it is believed that the heat released may enhance the evaporation of the nicotine.

 

[JW50]

Old Chemist - Here is another extract the reference cited above:

[0162]Experiment #1: Hydrochloric Acid and Ammonia were Used to Generate a Mixture of Vapors in a "Y" Shaped Tube that was then Passed Over Nicotine Free Base

[0163]Objective:

[0164]The aim was to evaluate the effectiveness of a chemically robust acid/base system to generate an aerosol of sufficient characteristics to aerosolize nicotine free base.

[0165]Experimental Design:

[0166]The experimental design included two identical glass test tubes (Tube A contained 5 ml of hydrochloric acid (HCl) and Tube B contained 5 ml ammonia (NH3)) connected through a "Y" shape tube designed to allow for the vapors from the two test tubes to be admixed instantly in the "Y" shape tubing and then passed over nicotine free base using a Controlled Puff Volume Apparatus, CPVA (40 cc air at 2 seconds' duration (3-second interval) for 100 times (100 puffs)). The admixture of HCl and NH3 vapors produced a white, dense and visible cloud.

The dense and visible cloud sounds as if it might be of interest to many of those commenting here. But, the ammonia doesn't sound too good by itself nor does the hydrochloric acid. Is the mixture here nicotine like I think many of us are looking for with a touch "salt". Or is this a nicotine salt that, by itself, sets off our nic receptors? If this is a salt of nicotine that is being created, how does Duke know - or anyone - that it has any meaningful effect on nic receptors? That is, plasma levels may be high but that alone doesn't, so it seems to be, prove it impacts us. Perhaps that salt gets collected - and we just pee it away. Seems like what is being measured is how much nic gets into blood, and how quick, not what it does to us in terms of what we are looking for. If it's giving use something and there is a dense and visible cloud - I might consider it if the price is right. But if price not right - e-cig is OK with me. (I do note from details, there may be a charcoal filter with this product. Perhaps not bad idea with e-cigs.)

 

[Thulium]

(I do note from details, there may be a charcoal filter with this product. Perhaps not bad idea with e-cigs.)

I think a charcoal filter could create more problems for vaping than it would solve. Propylene Glycol vapor is an air sanitizer and with no known chemical reactions occurring in e-cigs, there's not much that charcoal could filter out but I would hate to discover carbon leeching into otherwise clean vapor.

 

[JW50]

An extract of the nicorette or nicotrol patent:

Anti-oxidants such as butylated hydroxy toluene, butylated hydroxy anisole, propyl gallate or tertary butyl hydroxy quinone may also be added to the nicotine before or after impregnation into the porous plug 18. Such anti-oxidants, for example may be used to stabilize nicotine for a dispenser 10 with a longer shelf life.

Source: United States Patent: 4800903

Cigarette, NRTs, e-cigs, etc. - there seem to be additives.

 

[JW50]

I think a charcoal filter could create more problems for vaping than it would solve. Propylene Glycol vapor is an air sanitizer and with no known chemical reactions occurring in e-cigs, there's not much that charcoal could filter out but I would hate to discover carbon leeching into otherwise clean vapor.

If "no known chemical reactions" - I would think charcoal filter would be a problem. What problem do you foresee here? If nothing filtered - the charcoal will last forever - and - we have some added confidence. (Maybe.)

 

[JW50]

Correction - I would think charcoal filter would not be a problem.