Madison Co Board of Health (VA) passes 1st reading of e-cig usage ban

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Bill Godshall

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Madison County Board of Health passes first reading of e-cigarette usage ban citing inaccurate and misleading propaganda
http://richmondregister.com/localnews/x713545842/Smoke-or-vapor

It would be helpful if someone could find this proposed reg (via a search) and contact info for health board members and other county officials (so we can contact them, give them some truth, and urge them to reject proposal).
 

AlmightyGod

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"Smoking" also includes the use of an e-cigarette which creates a vapor, in any manner or in any form, or the use of any oral smoking device for the purpose of circumventing the prohibition of smoking in this Article.

They make it sound like we are using a PV for the sole purpose of avoiding smoking laws.
These people are obviously misinformed.

I think they should make a laws against being ugly & smelling bad, but I doubt we ever see it.
 

house mouse

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Ya know it's almost laughable watching the antis run around squawking because of vaping. Geeze, freaking Louise. Pass your ridiculously, ignorant ordinance already. Guess what? It won't stop anyone from stealth vaping, certainly won't stop me. Guarantee you I can sit right next to little ms/mr anti in a movie and vape my head off without them knowing. Course they're probably gonna start craving waffles for some strange reason. So like it or not legislators, we're here, we will not go away, and we will continue to vape in public. You'll just never know when you've just been "vaped".
 

Jenn1181

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I'm upset they have changed the definition of "smoking" to suit their agenda. Even if the only reason we vaped was to circumvent indoor or public smoking bans, what is the problem? The whole point of a smoking ban is to limit peoples exposure to secondhand smoke. If vapor rapidly dissipates, does not produce tar or a linger odor or filmy coating on surfaces, and has not been proven to cause adverse reactions in those with breathing conditions or allergies, then why do people care so much that people vape in public as a means to get around smoking bans? Some people use smokeless tobacco products in places where smoking is not permitted. I don't hear anyone getting in a tizzy over that.

I'm also highly disappointed in the amount of blatant misinformation presented on their e-cig "fact" sheet.

Wait, this one is my favorite:

Nicotine deposits react with an element in the air to form potent carcinogens

This is based off of the "thirdhand smoke" myth. A study was conducted that speculated residual nicotine lingers on surfaces a few hours after a person has smoked a cigarette in a confined space and releases "potent carcinogens". Sounds pretty scary. It is until you read the rest of this report which states nicotine residue reacts with ambient nitrous acid. Ambient nitrous acid detected indoors predominantly comes from unvented gas appliances, namely unvented gas fireplaces which (to my knowledge) aren't even legal to have in buildings in nearly every developed nation in the world.

Furthermore, this "potent carcinogen" fell into the tobacco-specific nitrosamines category (or TSNAs) which aren't even potent carcinogens in and among themselves. They are considered the most potent carcinogenic element found in the raw tobacco leaf. On top of that the only way they were able to eek any sort of trace of potentially cancer-causing levels of TSNAs during their study was when the researchers deposited heavy amounts of fresh cigarette smoke tar onto cellulose and then exposed that to high levels of nitrous acid for three hours in an enclosed environment. They found that this exposure of the cigarette smoke residue to high levels of nitrous acid produced ten times the amount of TSNAs you'd observe in a space in which a cigarette had just been smoked where nitrous acid was not present.

I think we all know that TSNAs are going to be mostly the result of tobacco leaf combustion. Since not only do ecigs not burn anything, rather release a mist resulting from a heated liquid, but they don't contain actual tobacco in the device or cartridge there is no evidence to prove that:

a) any significant trace of nicotine is released through the vapor.
b) that the vapor itself adheres to any surface, thus producing an exposure risk
c) that there is any risk of second-hand exposure to ecig vapor, let alone third-hand.

Conveniently enough, the researches reached a conclusion that would appeal to caring parents - your biggest risk is touching or inhaling dust from carpets that have been exposed to indoor smoking, hence crawling babies are at the biggest risk of exposure.

This is the sort of junk science that even lay people recognize as not being sound and it should be called out as such. The fact that these scientists have to resort to such extreme testing measures, that don't even remotely reflect real world scenarios and conditions, simply to yield a modicum of evidence that this presents a "danger" should be enough to prove these findings don't hold up when applied in real situations.
 

Vocalek

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Ya know it's almost laughable watching the antis run around squawking because of vaping. Geeze, freaking Louise. Pass your ridiculously, ignorant ordinance already. Guess what? It won't stop anyone from stealth vaping, certainly won't stop me. Guarantee you I can sit right next to little ms/mr anti in a movie and vape my head off without them knowing. Course they're probably gonna start craving waffles for some strange reason. So like it or not legislators, we're here, we will not go away, and we will continue to vape in public. You'll just never know when you've just been "vaped".

ROTFL - How Waffle! :laugh:
 

Placebo Effect

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Another article on the upcoming ban -- Smoke Versus Vapor

he Madison County Health Department is hoping to change the language in it's current regulation to ban these popular e-cigarettes from also being used in public places.

"Nationally, public health officials believe that the use of e-cigarettes and vapor stix confuse the existing and indoor air regulations or smoking regulations," says Christie Green

Workers at the popular Vapor Stix store in Richmond believe these e-cigarettes are much safer than a normal cigarette and they feel folks should be able to puff away indoors as they please.

"The user can still smoke getting all the regular poisons of a cigarette. But, they still can get their nicotine and there also is a non-nicotine available with these if they prefer to do that," says co-owner Jerry Hacker

The electronic cigarettes are battery operated and contain a liquid form of of nicotine and produces a vapor when inhaled.

"Its vapor is just like a humidifier in your home, it heats that up and creates a mist," mentions Hacker

The vapor-stix do not release any carbon monoxide or carbon dioxide chemicals, but regardless, health officials say the product is harmful enough to cause them to re-adjust county wide regulations to protect the public.

"We believe that the use of vapor stix and e-cigarettes model smoking behavior that has not been found as a successful cessation to stopping smoking," explains Green
 

rothenbj

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Are we talking about two different Madison Counties, one in Ky and one in Va?

I found this article from Oct where they even show the county on the map-

http://stogied.com/2010/10/12/madison-county-virginia-smoking-ban/

I found this information interesting-

"The Board of Health is now waiting on a legal review from the county attorney, whose recommendations will be reviewed at its next regular meeting, scheduled for early December. The PC Patrol there may find doing that to be more than a bit tricky
.
According to the state’s already-existing indoor smoking ban, local governments cannot regulate smoking by enacting laws more stringent than what the state already has in place. Already, a smoking ban specifically targeted at restaurants in the City of Norfolk was repealed by its City Council in early 2008, because the city’s attorney said their law would violate Virginia state law and would not survive legal challenges.

Stogie’d notes that two recent Richmond Register stories on the recent move by the county health board did not note the “more stringent” aspect of Virginia state law, nor did it mention the two-plus year old action in Norfolk." Emphasis mine

If this is accurate, our friendly ?non-profit?"health" organizations will have difficulty in Va back dooring regulation here.


*added on further review

http://www.kybizvoice.com/?p=71

Is it Both?? NO I think I've figured it out. Stogie'd saw the article in the Richmond Register and assumed Va and wrote the article on that basis. Being mentally special, it took me awhile to understand what was going on.
 
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Bill Godshall

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This is Madison County, Kentucky.

The only way a smoking ban ordinance can be amended to prohibit the indoor use of e-cigarettes is if there already exists a smoking ban ordinance. And as has been pointed out, state law in VA preempts local governments from enacting smoking ban ordinances.

Regardless, it appears that more letters and calls need to be made to the Madison County Board of Health members, and to local news media exposing the Board's inaccurate statements and absurd proposal.
 
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